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El futur és la vida

The future is life.

Nosaltres vivim en una societat presentista

We live in a presentist society.

que de vegades es troba en tot el que ve de l'abast

that is sometimes found in everything that comes from the scope

i només sap com parlar

and only knows how to speak

i està fascinat per la novel·litat i el que ve del futur.

and is fascinated by novelty and what comes from the future.

però hi ha gent que es dedica a revisar figures

but there are people who specialize in reviewing figures

del passat més recent i les seves escrites

from the most recent past and its writings

per entendre millor on venim

to better understand where we come from

per reconstruir històries i genealogies

to reconstruct stories and genealogies

des de noves perspectives

from new perspectives

i per fer la nostra interpretació del passat més rica

and to make our interpretation of the past richer

per tenir més tools per afrontar el present i el futur.

to have more tools to face the present and the future.

Avui farem això amb Brenna Moore,

Today we will do this with Brenna Moore.

professor de Teologia a la Universitat de Fora d'Adams.

Professor of Theology at the University of Outer Adams.

I benvinguts a un nou capítol d'Indefugibles.

And welcome to a new episode of Indefugibles.

Brenna Moore és professor de Teologia a la Universitat de Fora d'Adams.

Brenna Moore is a professor of Theology at the University of Outer Adams.

i benvinguts a un nou capítol d'Indefugibles.

And welcome to a new episode of Indefugibles.

I benvinguts a un nou capítol d'Indefugibles.

And welcome to a new episode of Indefugibles.

Brenna Moore és especialista en el tema de la modernitat cristiana

Brenna Moore is an expert on the subject of Christian modernity.

i es concentra en la història càntica i intel·lectual

and focuses on the singing and intellectual history

i en la història cultural d'Europa.

and in the cultural history of Europe.

Brenna, moltes gràcies per acompanyar-nos.

Brenna, thank you very much for accompanying us.

Moltes gràcies per haver-me acompanyat.

Thank you very much for accompanying me.

És meravellós estar amb tu en conversa aquí a Espanya.

It's wonderful to be with you in conversation here in Spain.

I també tenim Oriol, com de sol,

And we also have Oriol, like sunlight,

Hola Oriol.

Hello Oriol.

Hola a tots.

Hello everyone.

Qui és Brenna Moore?

Who is Brenna Moore?

I d'on ve aquest interès en la teologia?

And where does this interest in theology come from?

Bé, gràcies.

Good, thank you.

Jo ens ensenyo a la teologia a una escola de Jesuits a New York,

I teach theology at a Jesuit school in New York.

la Universitat de Fora d'Adams.

the University of Outside Adams.

He estat a Fora d'Adams 16 anys en la Departament de Teologia,

I have been outside of Adams for 16 years in the Department of Theology.

però vaig fer el meu PhD a la Universitat de Harvard,

but I did my PhD at Harvard University,

que és una escola secular, però té una gran escola de divinitat.

It is a secular school, but it has a great school of divinity.

Ells ens ensenyen la religió, la teologia,

They teach us religion, theology,

la religió des d'una perspectiva cultural,

religion from a cultural perspective,

la antropologia de la religió, les religioses del món,

the anthropology of religion, the religions of the world,

però la Universitat de Harvard, aleshores,

but Harvard University, at that time,

estava a pocs metres de la Seminària de Jesuits de l'Oest,

it was a few meters from the Jesuit Seminary of the West,

i tenien enrolaments oberts,

and they had open enrollments,

així que puc fer classes a Harvard,

so I can teach classes at Harvard,

però vaig fer moltes classes a la Seminària de Jesuits de l'Oest.

but I took many classes at the Jesuit Seminary of the West.

Vaig fer moltes classes amb un jesuit que és molt famós,

I took many classes with a very famous Jesuit.

potser algun de vosaltres ha sentit parlar d'ell,

maybe some of you have heard of him,

en John O'Malley, que ha escrit molt sobre la història dels jesuits,

John O'Malley, who has written extensively about the history of the Jesuits,

un monstre jesuit.

a Jesuit monster.

I a Harvard, les classes eren més sobre el estudi crític de la religió,

At Harvard, the classes were more about the critical study of religion,

la diversitat religiosa, la història feminista de la religió,

religious diversity, the feminist history of religion,

i després vaig fer moltes classes sobre la teologia cateològica tradicional.

And then I took many classes on traditional Catholic theology.

I m'ha agradat molt aquesta combinació

I really liked this combination.

d'aproximacions noves a la religió

of new approaches to religion

amb l'educació jesuita tradicional.

with traditional Jesuit education.

I després, quan vaig acabar el decret,

And then, when I finished the decree,

vaig començar a treballar a Fordham.

I started working at Fordham.

Uau, molt interessant.

Wow, very interesting.

Però sembla estrany per a nosaltres,

But it seems strange to us,

perquè si hi hagués un teològic aquí, una dona,

because if there were a theologian here, a woman,

seria un 99% que ella és una nana aquí a Espanya,

it would be 99% that she is a nanny here in Spain,

però tu ets una persona negra.

but you are a black person.

Com pot això passar?

How can this happen?

Com podem entendre que la gent estudi teologia

How can we understand that people study theology?

no per ser un preu?

Not for being a price?

No per raons professionals.

Not for professional reasons.

D'acord, d'acord.

Okay, okay.

Sí, a Fordham també,

Yes, at Fordham too,

vam tenir la primera...

we had the first...

la major part de les dones

most women

en el nostre departament van ser noves.

In our department, they were new.

Vam tenir preus i noves

We had prices and news.

en el departament,

in the department,

ensenyant temes més tradicionals,

teaching more traditional subjects,

però una de les més famoses noves

but one of the most famous new ones

que actualment ha estat publicada en espanyol,

that has currently been published in Spanish,

la seva noma és la srta. Elizabeth Johnson,

her name is Miss Elizabeth Johnson,

ella fa teologia feminista,

she does feminist theology,

i ella ensenyava al meu departament a Fordham.

And she taught in my department at Fordham.

Recentment es va retirar.

Recently, he/she has retired.

Però ella va arrencar el camí

But she started the journey.

per l'invitació de moltes persones a Fordham

for the invitation of many people to Fordham

a pensar que no podíem fer teologia sense dones.

to think that we could not do theology without women.

I no hi ha res de raó

And there is no reason for it.

que hagis de fer teologia

that you have to study theology

només si ets una nana o un preu.

only if you are a dwarf or a price.

I ara tenim moltes dones al departament.

And now we have many women in the department.

Estic marit, tinc dues filles,

I am married, I have two daughters,

tinc una filla de 15 anys

I have a 15-year-old daughter.

i un fill de 11 anys.

and an 11-year-old son.

I tenim altres dones al departament

And we have other women in the department.

que també són noves,

that are also new,

totes tenen filles.

They all have daughters.

I tenim una dona de 15 anys,

We have a 15-year-old woman,

unotres tenen 15.

One of them has 15.

I tenim una altra dones que són a les xarxes,

And we have其他 women who are on social media,

que escolten el judais.

that they listen to the Jews.

Trobem una altra dona que és a des del chat.

We find another woman who is in the chat.

El departament de teologia a Fordham

The department of theology at Fordham

ha estat oberto a estudiar

he has been open to studying

i ensenyar als nostres estudiants

and teach our students

altres tradicions religioses

other religious traditions

i ensenyar el profund connecte

and teach the deep connection

de la espiritualitat càtola,

of Catholic spirituality,

la història càtola

the Catalan history

i la teologia càtola

and the Catholic theology

de la gent de la gent.

of the people of the people.

Però jo sóc càtola.

But I am a cat.

Soc cràtica càtola.

I am a critical cat.

I no sóc com ensenyar el catolicisme

And I am not here to teach Catholicism.

com menys el dia a dia,

as less the day to day,

social scientist, you know, for me

it is a living tradition, very

connected with the living tradition of Catholicism

and I take, and I'm close to

many communities of nuns and priests

and I take my students to

you know, to meet

communities of nuns, to meet the Benedictines

on their farm, to meet

you know, so for me all of that

You know, so for me all of that.

is very, very important

but I do it from the perspective

of a lay person. That's very interesting

of a lay person. That's very interesting.

because we are not used to this

level of pluralism in our

schools, in our

cities. Yeah, and I think

ciutats. Sí, i crec

you know, it's different, you know, the United States

is so big

and it's different at other Jesuit

schools in other parts of the country but

escoles en altres parts del país però

New York is just so diverse

New York és tan divers.

it's so diverse and

the Bronx in particular is so diverse

and a lot of, you know, our students

who maybe

don't live on campus, they live in New York City

they don't live on campus, they live in New York City.

with their family and commute

amb la seva família i desplaçaments

a lot of them are Muslim

many of them are Muslim

or even Hindu, families from Pakistan

India, so it really

if we really

want to have our students

in our theology classes

learn about their own faith traditions

and take very

i agafa molt

seriously the personal questions

about belief in God, about faith

about the meaning of

evil, goodness, justice

we really have to do it from a

We really have to do it from a

diverse perspective and I don't

know if this is, maybe this is

saber si això és, potser això és

I know this is true in many schools in the United

I know this is true in many schools in the United.

States that there's usually

Estableix que normalment hi ha

more women in our class, more female

students than male students

and so

it would really make no sense if it was

all men teaching Catholicism

tots els homes que ensenyen el catolicisme

that really wouldn't fit our student

that really wouldn't suit our student

body, especially because we

want them, you know, to

see these traditions as

living traditions, as

contemporary traditions that speak to us

today, these aren't just relics from the past

Today, these aren't just relics from the past.

or we're not just looking at a museum

you know, so we love

to have, you know, representatives

from living traditions and invite

our female students to meet

feminist theologians, to talk about

how you can have a robust

faith life and be a mother and

fe, vida i ser mare i

have a career, so we

it's really important for us

to meet our students where they are and to

represent these traditions in a way

that kind of reflects our student body

això reflecteix el nostre alumnat

Yeah

I have a question

I have a question.

you've been a teacher for a long time now

You've been a teacher for a long time now.

and what is the

can you remember any

Can you remember any?

moment throughout your career

moment durant la teva carrera

in the classroom, I mean

that was a special moment

you had to single out a moment of

I don't know

a moment of revelation or something

a moment that was very significant

in the exercise of teaching

what would you say?

What would you say?

Yes, I, you know, I think

I've learned so much from the

Jesuits about teaching the whole

Jesuits sobre l'ensenyament del tot.

person, you know, and the whole person

in their ethical dimension, their spiritual

life, you know, not just

you know, here, read this theology book, take a test

and I have

really been shaped by

realment ha estat modelat per

Jesuit pedagogy and

one

memory I have that is so special to me

A memory I have that is so special to me.

is I had the students

if I had the students

at the end of the semester

give a short six minute

give a short six-minute

presentation about how any

Presentation about how any

text from the semester

has helped them have a deeper

understanding of something in their own life

like their family, their

I'm copying this exercise

I'm copying this exercise.

right now for my students

Yes, okay, so

in our classroom we often have

real, a lot of disparities

in wealth, you know, we have

wealthy families whose maybe the

father is a banker on Wall Street

Father is a banker on Wall Street.

they have a house in the Hamptons

They have a house in the Hamptons.

but we have, you know, students who are Pakistani

immigrants who dad, father is a taxi

immigrants whose dad is a taxi driver

driver, you know, in one classroom

and I had one student

i tenia un alumne

you know, give her presentation at the

You know, give her presentation at the

end of the semester, a white student

very beautiful and she

said, well

we read Paul Ricoeur

about beauty and I

about beauty and me

love the beauty of the sunset

at the beach and she showed a picture

of herself on her boat

in her bikini at the beach

and it was like, okay, you know, glad you

learned something, not the most profound

you know, not the most profound experience

but that is our classroom, that is

our experience, you know, she

did understand something about the nature

Did understand something about the nature.

of beauty, okay, then literally

30 seconds later, the next student

a Muslim student in hijab

is a pre-health student

going to medical school

and she said that

i ella va dir que

she was so transformed

by Gustavo Gutierrez

and liberation theology

i la teologia de la alliberament

about faith seeking justice

and she had

decided through a lot of reflection

decided after a lot of reflection

in this class

where we did a lot on spirituality and justice

where we focused a lot on spirituality and justice

that she really wanted

to use her

medical degree after medical school

doctor's degree after medical school

to go to places in the world

of extreme suffering and violence

and maybe even

i potser fins i tot

work for Doctors Without Borders

and go to Syria

i anar a Síria

and she was so transformed but she said

the problem is her family

are from Bengali

són de bengalí

and they left

i van marxar

violent precarity

to come to the United States

and in Islam, you know, you

I don't have a specific phrase to translate from your text. Could you please provide the complete sentence or text you would like translated from Catalan to English?

very much are, say, close to your family

you are very close to your family, they say.

and her family

i la seva família

would be horrified

like why would you ever go back

to that part of the world

we left that

and she loves her parents

i ella estima els seus pares.

and her parents helped her get this education

and so she said

i així ho va dir

she does not know how she will live

with this tension of this desire

amb aquesta tensió d'aquest desig

to serve and desire

to go from the mission

to leave the mission

to the poor and precarity

to dedication to her family

and in hijab

and how profound

i quina profunditat

that is and what a profound

student this is

this is student

what a profound person

and a profound reflection on her life

and what she is going to use her education for

you know, compared to the student

on the boat

and it's just in one classroom

and I just thought

i només vaig pensar

you know, how

what a gift this is to just be with these

with kind of this extreme difference

amb aquesta mena de diferencia extrema

but also like these students who are so serious

però també com aquests estudiants que són tan seriosos

and so profound

i tan profund

and then I'm still in touch with that student

this student was in my class maybe 10 years ago

and now she's done with medical school

but she stayed in the United States

però ella es va quedar als Estats Units

but she's a doctor at a community health clinic

but she’s a doctor at a community health clinic

working with immigrants and the poor

you know, she didn't really need to go to Syria

You know, she didn't really need to go to Syria.

it's like in New York we have precarity

It's like in New York we have precarity.

we have

and so she's still

i així que ella encara és

you know, safe and with near her family

you know, safe and close to her family

but I'm just so blessed

però sóc tan beneït

to be part of students like that

their journey, you know

el seu viatge, ja ho saps

that's a great experience, yes

I would like to talk a little bit about your field of study

I would like to talk a little bit about your field of study.

you wrote a book

about what you call spiritual friendship

about people that from their Catholicism

about people who draw from their Catholicism

they fight it against

or position against

the extreme right-wing movements at that time

100 years ago

100 anys enrere

maybe that teaches us something for our times

what is this concept of a spiritual friendship

What is this concept of spiritual friendship?

and who are these people that you study

and you read a lot about them

and you talk about them in your book

who are them?

Who are they?

yeah, thank you

sí, gràcies

yes, so in

I think it was 2021

I think it was 2021.

my book came out

it's called Kindred Spirits

It's called Kindred Spirits.

Friendship and Resistance at the Edges of Modern Catholicism

Amistat i Resistència a les Ments del Catolicisme Modern

and I say this is a history at the edges of modern Catholicism

And I say this is a history at the edges of modern Catholicism.

because it's a history of

communities dedicated to spiritual friendship

that I discovered in the archives

you know, so it's kind of at the edges

You know, so it's kind of at the edges.

on the margins of mainstream Catholic history

and I do

I do.

and I'll tell you how I discovered this

I do a lot of research on the history of women

I do a lot of research on the history of women.

women writers, women intellectuals

and that is not in canonical history

you have to kind of create new knowledge

you go to archives

studied unpublished documents

and my first book was about

Raisa Maritain

Jacques Maritain's wife

Jacques Maritain's esposa

who was a mystic and a poet and a writer

and when I went to her archive in France

I found all her letters and correspondence

I found all her letters and correspondence.

and photos and devotional material

all the material stuff of her history

of intellectual life

and it was totally about friendship

you know, she had vast correspondences with friends

You know, she had extensive correspondence with friends.

and when I opened up letters that she wrote to friends

that she received from friends

there were often little spiritual medals and crosses

There were often little spiritual medals and crosses.

almost like the letters themselves were spiritual objects

you know

and her memoir was called

Les Grandes Amitiés

The Great Friendships

you know, Great Friendship

and she had her devotional life

was often, you know, pictures of saints

popes

you know, pictures mixed with pictures of her friends

so her spiritual life was very much powered by her friendship

So her spiritual life was very much fueled by her friendship.

but I didn't want to write my first book about friendship

because I was young

and I thought, oh, that's so typical feminine

and I thought, oh, that's so typically feminine

I'm a woman writing about women

I'm a woman writing about women.

writing about friendship

that's kind of soft

but then when I got a little older

I thought, who cares?

I don't care if people think it's soft

I don't care if people think it's soft.

it's true

it's truly what was so important

and I realized that she was just the beginning

of this vast world of

faith intellectuals

who were active in the years before Vatican II

working on Christianity and democracy

Christian antifascism

all around the world

tota volta al món

many of them had connections to Paris

but were working all over the world

però estàvem treballant arreu del món

building the foundations for Vatican II

but in every case

però en cada cas

friendship was the most important thing in their lives

Friendship was the most important thing in their lives.

most of them were lay people

most of them were laypeople

and so my book was called Thepra metre A, you see?

And so my book was called Thepra metre A, you see?

It's all about friendship

It's all about friendship.

No, we're not talking about a ft obsessionism

No, we're not talking about a fetish obsession.

No, we're not talking no케

No, we’re not talking.

cada capítol és com un petit trio de amistats, o un parell de amistats,

each chapter is like a small trio of friendships, or a couple of friendships,

i sobre com van entendre la pràctica de l'amistat per la seva vida espiritual,

and about how they understood the practice of friendship for their spiritual life,

però també era una metàfora per a moltes de la feina de solidaritat.

but it was also a metaphor for much of the work of solidarity.

A França, les seves organitzacions, les seves petites associacions,

In France, its organizations, its small associations,

tenien la llengua d'amitié, d'amistat, la llengua de la feina de solidaritat,

they had the language of friendship, the language of solidarity work,

era el nom de les associacions en contra de l'antisemita.

It was the name of the associations against the anti-Semite.

Però també a Harlem, als Estats Units, hi havia aquestes petites comunitats utòpiques

But there were also these small utopian communities in Harlem, in the United States.

de relacions interracials negres i noves, i es deia la casa de la feina de solidaritat.

of new black interracial relationships, and it was called the house of the work of solidarity.

Aleshores, hi havia aquestes petites comunitats experimentals

At that time, there were these small experimental communities.

que van arribar a les metàfores de la feina de solidaritat

that reached the metaphors of the work of solidarity

com una manera d'entendre noves formes de solidaritat,

as a way of understanding new forms of solidarity,

però també hi va haver molts debats sobre el que volia dir això.

but there were also many debates about what this meant.

Algunes persones pensaven que la feina de solidaritat era l'última meta,

Some people thought that the work of solidarity was the final goal,

que si podem ser amics com els negres i les noves, el món serà millor.

that if we can be friends with blacks and the new ones, the world will be better.

Però moltes persones, molts negres pensaven que això era naïf,

But many people, many black people thought that this was naïve,

que la feina de solidaritat era el lloc de començar,

that the work of solidarity was the place to start,

que comences amb la feina de solidaritat,

that you start with the work of solidarity,

i després junts treballes per fer reals canvis en la societat.

And then together you work to make real changes in society.

La feina de solidaritat no és l'endemà, sinó el principi.

The work of solidarity is not tomorrow, but the beginning.

Aleshores, la feina de solidaritat era l'última meta,

Then, the work of solidarity was the final goal,

que va ser la que va ser la meua reacció.

what my reaction was.

El meu llibreث és molt sobre les tensions

My book is very much about the tensions.

sobre el que vol dir la solidaritat

about what solidarity means

i la rol de la solidaritat.

and the role of solidarity.

Però en cada cas, explorava la rol són de les dones

But in each case, she explored the role of women.

en el llibre,

in the book,

i ho vaig haver de veure des de la recerca d'arquipers.

And I had to see it from the search for archers.

Vaig anar a uns arxius a França,

I went to some archives in France,

i alguns arxius eren digititzats a bereig de Chile,

and some files were digitized at the behest of Chile,

però vaig fer molt de recerca d'arquipers a Harlem.

but I did a lot of research on archipers in Harlem.

Vaig incloure una comunitat global

I included a global community.

de creadors cátolics molt creatius

of very creative Catholic creators

Està completament animat pel poder de la amistat

He is completely uplifted by the power of friendship.

en les seves vies espirituals i polítiques.

in their spiritual and political paths.

I això és el que té a veure amb aquest llibre.

And this is what has to do with this book.

Però també hi ha una tradició en el catolicisme

But there is also a tradition in Catholicism.

que discuteix de la amistat, no?

that discusses friendship, right?

Sí.

Yes.

Bé, no sé si puc comentar cap autora ara,

Well, I don't know if I can comment on any author now,

però crec que la amistat espiritual és una cosa

but I believe that spiritual friendship is one thing

que s'ha discutit en la tradició catòlica.

that has been discussed in the Catholic tradition.

De fet, si penses en els jesuits,

In fact, if you think about the Jesuits,

s'ha dit que tenen els noms dels companys amb ells sempre.

It has been said that they always have the names of their companions with them.

Sí, en el seu cor.

Yes, in his heart.

Sí, tenen els noms de les seves lletres.

Yes, they have the names of their letters.

100%, 100%.

De fet, la major part de la gent que he estudiat

In fact, most of the people I have studied.

que venia del segle XX

that came from the 20th century

era el que jo dic de neomedieval.

It was what I call neo-medieval.

Ells van fer molta lectura sobre comunitats monàstiques medievals,

They did a lot of reading about medieval monastic communities,

i hi ha un segle XII

and there is a twelfth century

que es diu Amicítia Espiritual.

which is called Spiritual Friendship.

Hi ha llibres sobre amistat espiritual

There are books about spiritual friendship.

de lletres del segle XII i XIII.

of letters from the 12th and 13th centuries.

Una de les dones, una dona de França

One of the women, a woman from France.

que va ser activa en la resistència a l'antisemita,

that was active in the resistance to anti-Semitism,

Marie-Madeleine Davy,

és de França,

he is from France,

era una escola de monàsticisme cistercià,

it was a school of Cistercian monasticism,

però ha escrit molts llibres

but he has written many books

sobre el rol de la amistat

about the role of friendship

en la vida de la comunitat cistercià i monàstica.

in the life of the Cistercian and monastic community.

És una idea medieval

It is a medieval idea.

que ve de les comunitats monàstiques

that comes from the monastic communities

que han de trobar

that they have to find

amor i vida a l'exterior,

love and life outside,

la família nuclear a l'exterior,

the nuclear family outside,

la sexualitat a l'exterior,

sexuality outdoors,

i que per a elles

and that for them

les comunitats de amistat

the communities of friendship

són partners crucials

they are crucial partners

en el camí cap a Déu.

on the way to God.

És una idea molt càtolica

It's a very Catholic idea.

i hi ha coses com Jean de Chantal...

And there are things like Jean de Chantal...

Estic pensant en Simone B.

I am thinking of Simone B.

i en Marie-Madeleine Davy,

and in Marie-Madeleine Davy,

perquè ella escriu sobre la amistat

because she writes about friendship

com un sentit implícit de l'amor de Déu.

with an implicit sense of God's love.

És un text bonic.

It is a beautiful text.

Una de les temes del meu llibre

One of the themes of my book.

és que a vegades

it's just that sometimes

la amistat es troba

Friendship is found.

en el que jo dic

in what I say

els realms no ordinaris de la consciència,

the extraordinary realms of consciousness,

en la memòria,

in the memory,

en la imaginació, en la pedagogia,

in imagination, in pedagogy,

en la amistat,

in friendship,

en la amistat invisible.

in invisible friendship.

I és molt com

And it's very like

la devota a un sainte,

the devotee to a saint,

com una amistat en el teu cor.

like a friendship in your heart.

Aquesta dona,

This woman,

que era la escolta del monasticisme Davy,

that was the guard of the Davy monasticism,

era una amistat de Simone B.

It was a friendship of Simone B.

a França.

to France.

I ella dedicava

She dedicated.

aquesta comunitat utòpica

this utopian community

a la postguerra a França,

in post-war France,

dedicada a l'amistat internacional,

dedicated to international friendship,

a la memòria de Simone B.

In memory of Simone B.

Es deia Maison Simone B.

It was called Maison Simone B.

Però era sobre

But it was about

la seva amistat

his friendship

en la memòria de Simone B.

In memory of Simone B.

Però Simone B.

But Simone B.

és molt crucial en aquesta història.

It is very crucial in this story.

És el mateix amb la monàstica.

It is the same with monasticism.

Crec que és una manera molt càntica

I think it is a very lyrical way.

de ser, i crec que

to be, and I think that

l'altre punt del meu llibre

the other point of my book

és que crec que tots

It's just that I think that everyone

entenem el catolicisme

we understand Catholicism

com una feina comunal,

as a communal job,

que és diferent de la feina

that is different from work

individual més protestant,

more protesting individual,

però sovint pensem en la feina comunal

but we often think about the communal work

com la Iglesia,

like the Church,

o el París, o l'Institut,

either Paris or the Institute,

però sovint a l'altre punt

but often at the other point

la feina comunal és més

the communal work is more

íntima, més interpersonal.

intimate, more interpersonal.

La amistat és una mena

Friendship is a kind

d'una manera més íntima de pensar sobre la comunitat

in a more intimate way of thinking about the community

que només la Iglesia, que a vegades és

that only the Church, which at times is

més gran.

bigger.

Uau, fantàstic.

Wow, fantastic.

Tens alguna pregunta?

Do you have any questions?

No, hem d'acabar,

No, we have to finish.

però potser tenim temps per

but perhaps we have time for

alguna cosa més.

something else.

Estava pensant que una de les raons

I was thinking that one of the reasons

per les quals m'agrada venir aquí

for which I like to come here

a treballar a l'IQS

to work at IQS

és la amistat.

It is friendship.

Crec que l'amistat és molt important

I believe that friendship is very important.

fins i tot en un

even in one

nivell de dia a dia.

day-to-day level.

És el que et manté motivat

It's what keeps you motivated.

a vegades quan

sometimes when

tot el que fa mal

everything that hurts

a la feina, per exemple.

at work, for example.

Per exemple,

For example,

m'acompanyaré amb els meus amics.

I will be accompanied by my friends.

I la connexió amb l'amistat

And the connection with friendship

és espiritual,

it is spiritual,

perquè l'amistat és

because friendship is

mantenir una distància,

maintain a distance,

però també ser molt intimats.

but also be very intimate.

És una imatge de la relació

It is an image of the relationship.

que hem tingut amb el Déu

that we have had with God

com a persones feliços.

as happy people.

No ho sé.

I don't know.

Sí, absolutament.

Yes, absolutely.

Una de les coses que m'agrada

One of the things I like.

en el departament de teologia

in the department of theology

és que crec que el nostre facultat

I think that our faculty

té un sentit intuïtiu d'això,

has an intuitive sense of this,

l'importància de la amistat

the importance of friendship

i el poder espiritual de l'amistat.

and the spiritual power of friendship.

En el nostre departament

In our department

tenim retreats juntes,

we have retreats together,

encara que estiguem tot el dia

even if we are here all day

per menjar,

to eat,

per fer retreats,

to hold retreats,

i ens sentim connectats com a comunitat.

And we feel connected as a community.

Crec que és perquè no és

I think it's because it isn't.

una comunitat secular.

a secular community.

I fins i tot els no-catholics,

And even non-Catholics,

és l'enviat,

he is the envoy,

l'enviat invisible,

the invisible envoy,

valora la amistat espiritual.

value spiritual friendship.

Crec que és per la nostra raó càntica.

I think it's because of our canticle reason.

Ens has dit

You have told us.

que has escrit un llibre

that you have written a book

que ha aparegut ara.

that has appeared now.

És exactament el títol del llibre?

Is it exactly the title of the book?

Sí.

Yes.

És un llibre que

It is a book that

ve d'una de les preguntes

comes from one of the questions

en el meu primer llibre,

in my first book,

que es diu

what is it called

Mutualitat en el barri,

Mutuality in the neighborhood,

històries de les petites sisters de l'assumpció.

stories of the little sisters of the Assumption.

I sé que no tenim molt de temps,

I know we don't have much time,

però diré unes sentències.

but I will say a few sentences.

Però he estat involucrada

But I have been involved.

durant molts anys com a voluntària

for many years as a volunteer

amb una comunitat de nois a l'est de Harlem

with a community of boys in East Harlem

que fan un treball increïble

that do an incredible job

per als migrants a l'est de Harlem

for the migrants in East Harlem

i l'immigració.

and immigration.

I he escrit un llibre sobre la seva història

I have written a book about his story.

que es diu Mutualitat en el barri.

it's called Mutualitat in the neighborhood.

Ells utilitzen aquest concepte

They use this concept.

com una mena d'orientació de valor,

with a kind of value orientation,

que no només van a ajudar els pobres,

that they will not only help the poor,

sinó que estan en relacions mutuals

but they are in mutual relationships

de respecte i amor

of respect and love

amb els migrants.

with the migrants.

I sovint els migrants fan molta lideratge

And often migrants show a lot of leadership.

a l'organització

to the organization

i treballen allà.

and they work there.

No és només la hieràquia

It is not just the hierarchy.

que els ajuda.

that helps them.

Crec que la mutualitat

I believe that the mutuality

és una altra manera

it's another way

d'explicar-ho.

to explain it.

Ells encara no coneixen

They still don't know.

les persones que he escrit

the people I have written

en el meu primer llibre,

in my first book,

però és una visió mundial

but it is a global vision

de la mutualitat,

of the mutuality,

de la amistat espiritual,

of spiritual friendship,

de la comunitat,

of the community,

i de tot el món.

and from all over the world.

És el que més m'agrada

It's what I like the most.

sobre el catolicisme.

about Catholicism.

Moltes gràcies.

Thank you very much.

Aquesta conversa m'ha confirmat

This conversation has confirmed to me.

l'importància de tenir la teologia

the importance of having theology

d'aquest llibre.

of this book.

Moltes gràcies, Berena.

Thank you very much, Berena.

Gràcies per haver-me acompanyat.

Thank you for accompanying me.

Va ser meravellós estar en conversa.

It was wonderful to be in conversation.

Gràcies a tu.

Thank you.

Gràcies a tu també, Oriol.

Thank you too, Oriol.

Ens trobem al següent capítol

We meet in the next chapter.

d'In the Fuji+.

in the Fuji+.

Fins demà!

See you tomorrow!

Spiritual friendship, with Brenna Moore