游戏圆桌 | 只有服务型游戏需要服务，吗？

字幕志愿者 杨栋梁

Subtitle Volunteer Yang Dongliang

大家好 欢迎收听季后网播客游戏频道的游戏圆桌节目

Hello everyone, welcome to the game roundtable show of the postseason podcast gaming channel.

我是罗马

I am Rome.

大家好 我是麦克斯

Hello everyone, I am Max.

我是罗马

I am Rome.

我是钟青

I am Zhong Qing.

圆桌其实好久没录了

The roundtable hasn't been recorded in a long time.

每次主要现在大家讨论事情的时候

Every time when everyone is discussing things now.

都比较瞻前顾后

They tend to be overly cautious and hesitant.

随便一点事再放在网上就想不到

I can't imagine something so trivial being posted online.

你看黑神话的当时我就说

I said that when I saw Black Myth.

这游戏肯定火

This game is definitely going to be popular.

火完之后肯定有一些咱想不到的节奏

After the fire, there will definitely be some rhythms that we can't anticipate.

没错

That's right.

现在网上说啥我也看不懂

I can't understand anything that is said online now.

就是这么个情况

That’s the situation.

今天也是我最近玩黑神话

Today is also when I recently played Black Myth.

这游戏就是突然间萌生的一个想法

This game is an idea that suddenly came to mind.

就是感觉好像是

It just feels like.

本来我们觉得这个游戏有不同赛道

Originally, we thought this game had different tracks.

有不同的类型

There are different types.

可能就是你玩这个的是玩那个的

It might be that what you're playing is what they're playing.

不一样

Not the same.

但后来我发现

But later I发现.

就是看着大家讨论这个游戏的一些设计等等

It's just watching everyone discuss the design of this game and so on.

各方面

All aspects

我发现其实完全不相干的游戏

I found that the games are actually completely unrelated.

但是因为大家共享一个玩家市场

But because everyone shares a player market.

其实是互相还是不能说没关系

Actually, it’s still not appropriate to say it doesn’t matter between each other.

有影响的

Influential

比如说我最近就是在打黑神话的

For example, I've recently been playing Black Myth.

这个

This

就是真成就

It is true achievement.

然后我就发现一个事

Then I realized something.

就是他里边设计了一些

He designed some things inside.

那个要靠几率刷的东西

That thing depends on chance to obtain.

有些朋友也在抱怨这个事

Some friends are also complaining about this matter.

草药啥的

Herbs and such.

甚至有一些就是不打怪

Some even don't fight monsters at all.

但你要从那个地上踩那个药

But you have to step on that medicine on the ground.

要一定几率出

It must have a certain probability of occurring.

然后当时我玩的时候

Then when I was playing at that time

我第一直觉上也是觉得

My first instinct is also that...

有点

A little bit.

没必要

Not necessary.

有点傻逼

A bit of a fool.

就没必要

Then there is no need.

就是这个客气点说没必要

It's just that it's not necessary to be so polite.

后来玩着玩着

Later, while playing around.

但是我也玩过什么那种刷的游戏

But I've also played those kinds of grinding games.

我觉得他这游戏的案件

I think the cases in his game are...

从我个人体感几率来讲

From my personal experience and perception of probability.

倒是没有特难为你说特别难出什么

Actually, it's not particularly difficult for me to say what is especially hard to come by.

但可能分人

But it may vary by person.

有些人可能赶上了

Some people may have caught up.

有人巨难出

Someone is having great difficulties.

出那么就踩几百次

If it comes out, step on it hundreds of times.

对就是不出

That's right, just don't go out.

哪里吧

Where is it?

然后我就想我说这个

Then I thought I would say this.

你说

You say.

我就想半天自己在想

I just wanted to think to myself for a long time.

说这算不算是游戏的一个问题

Is this considered a problem with the game?

就他肯定不是没做好

He definitely didn't do it poorly.

他就选择说

He just chose to say.

我这游戏里有一些收集的东西

I have some collectible items in this game.

其实他对游戏

In fact, he is into games.

你要真说玩也没啥影响

If you really say that playing doesn't have any impact.

有那玩没那玩

Having that is not the same as not having it.

根本就无所谓

It doesn't matter at all.

有了你也不会用

Even if I had it, I wouldn't know how to use it.

就是不是什么特别

It's just nothing special.

特别有用的东西

Especially useful things.

我总想这个事

I always think about this matter.

这是一种二项性

This is a duality.

思考

Thinking

我就是很好奇

I am just very curious.

你说他到底自己测试的时候

What did you say he tested by himself?

他是要的就是这个

What he wants is just this.

我要的就是有的人

What I want is certain people.

一百小时弄不出来

It can't be done in one hundred hours.

有的人两三下弄出来

Some people can do it in two or three tries.

还是说他压根就没想到这一步

Or is it that he never even considered this step?

我就不知道

I don't know.

对啊

That's right.

我就总我很好奇这个事

I'm just really curious about this matter.

因为我也没参加过游戏开发什么的

Because I have never participated in game development or anything like that.

因为他肯定不是说

Because he definitely didn't say.

我们没做好

We didn't do well.

导致这个就是玩家

The cause of this is the players.

这个体验不好

This experience is not good.

那你说他是个缺点

Then you say he has a flaw.

那人其实在游戏整体上

That person is actually in the overall game.

其实没啥影响

It actually doesn't have much of an impact.

是你是你非要说

It's you, it's you who insists on saying it.

我要有一个全成就

I want to have a complete achievement.

全成就

All achievements.

自己较劲

Competing with oneself.

完了说这个

That's all I want to say.

对我确实同感

I really feel the same way.

包括这游戏就是好多地方

Including this game, there are many places.

我都想

I want it all.

比如说那空气墙的事

For example, the matter of the air wall.

因为可能这个

Because this might be the case.

我就是这个年龄大一点

I am just a little older at this age.

玩的三十年游戏

Playing games for thirty years.

就小

Just small.

以前我小的时候

When I was younger

那些就是刚3D的时候

Those were the early days of 3D.

动作游戏

Action game

就空气

Just air.

就肯定是空气墙的

It must be an air wall.

包括鬼气也好

Including ghostly energy is fine too.

什么也好

Anything is fine.

对

Correct.

全都是空气墙

It's all air walls.

就对这事

Just about this matter.

但我知道这游戏

But I know this game.

它的原因是因为

The reason is because

它设计有问题

There is a design problem.

它是那个

It is that.

没有统一性

Lack of unity.

让你远远的看出来

Let you see it from a distance.

不

No.

就分不清

Just can't tell apart.

有这能去

There is a way to go.

有这不能去

You can't go there.

像以前老的游戏

Like the old games from before.

就是你

It's you.

你遇到一次

You encountered it once.

你就知道这游戏

You just know this game.

这样的地方全是墙

Places like this are all walls.

你就沿着墙走

Just walk along the wall.

就是这游戏

It's this game.

就是给你点开放性

It's just giving you a bit of openness.

完了随后还用墙

After it's finished, it can still be used with the wall.

就是这个体验不好

It's just that this experience is not good.

不统一

Not unified.

对

Correct.

但是其实我

But actually, I...

特别负面的情绪

Especially negative emotions.

没产生

Did not produce.

这个是我跟

This is me with...

就是别的玩家

It's just other players.

没不太一样的地方

There's not much difference.

但虽然我们当时

But although we at that time

那个就是这个

That is this.

提前玩完之后

After finishing ahead of time.

也跟大家说了这个事

I also told everyone about this matter.

就因为

Just because.

因为它特别明显

Because it is particularly obvious.

但是对有些人来说

But for some people,

这个事

This matter.

用看有些网上骂

Some people are criticizing it online.

特别难听

Especially unpleasant to hear.

就是什么

It's just what.

就是

Just.

比较常见的一种说法是

A more common saying is

游戏应该能给个9分

The game should score a 9 out of 10.

空气墙不行

The air wall is not working.

7.5

7.5

我觉得空气墙

I think the air wall.

能值得让你扣这么多吗

Is it worth you deducting so much?

我会

I can.

要分人

To divide people.

这个其实对你来说

This is actually for you.

可能对我来说

Possibly for me

也其实不是什么特别大的事

It's actually not a big deal.

有的人可能在乎

Some people might care.

对

Correct.

你再比如说游戏没有地图

For example, you could say that the game doesn't have a map.

就是我就想

I just want to.

游戏科学肯定不是因为

Game science is definitely not because of...

它就是地图

It is the map.

是一个很高精简的事

It is a very streamlined matter.

这个技术实现不了

This technology cannot be realized.

也不是说游戏

It's not that the game...

不是

No.

也不是说他们

It's not to say that they...

他们公司没听说过

Their company has not heard of it.

说游戏有地图这个事

Talking about the fact that games have maps.

他们选择不做地图

They chose not to make a map.

这是选择

This is a choice.

你跟我说这个选题的时候

When you told me about this topic.

你的意思是

What you mean is

你觉得这是跟

Do you think this is related?

现在大伙都玩持续运营

Now everyone is playing continuous operation.

类游戏多

There are many types of games.

才导致了新的矛盾和冲突吗

Did it only lead to new contradictions and conflicts?

不是矛盾冲突

Not a contradiction or conflict.

就是我是想说

I just want to say.

环境不一样

The environment is different.

对玩家

To the players.

因为这个事对我来说

Because this matter is important to me.

就不是问题

It's not a problem.

我包括之前

I include before.

龙心条2这种游戏

Dragon Heart Strip 2 is this kind of game.

就明显它有些事

It is obvious that it has some matters.

它不是它不知道

It is not that it doesn't know.

也不是它没做好

It's not that it didn't do well.

是它我就是要这样

It is it, this is how I want it.

就是

Exactly.

有些事我要难为难为你

There are some things I want to make difficult for you.

有些事我不做的那种便利

Some things I choose not to do for the sake of convenience.

因为现在游戏就是讲的特别

Because now games are particularly focused on storytelling.

至少在功能性上

At least in terms of functionality.

讲的特别便利

Very convenient to talk about.

就是大家这个事

It's just everyone's matter.

已经不是技术上

No longer a technical issue.

难以实现的事了

Things that are difficult to achieve.

然后你没做

Then you didn't do it.

那我就认为你

Then I think you

有缺陷

Defective

对玩家不够诚恳

Not sincere enough towards players.

服务没做到位

The service was not up to standard.

对

Yes.

对就服务这个事

Regarding the matter of service.

是我觉得在服务型游戏

I think it is in service-oriented games.

服务类游戏

Service-oriented games

就是特别成为主流之后

It is especially after becoming mainstream.

玩家特别比以前改变的

Players have changed significantly compared to before.

一个对游戏要求的点

One point regarding the requirements of the game.

对

Yes.

就以前

Just like before.

对

Correct.

但在功能性上

But in terms of functionality

玩家没有那么苛刻

Players are not that demanding.

更注重内容上

Pay more attention to the content.

内容做的好

The content is well done.

其实有些功能做的差一点

Actually, some features are a bit lacking.

大家会认为这是小瑕疵

Everyone would think this is a minor flaw.

现在完全不是这样

It's completely different now.

就是在内容先放下

Just put the content down first.

有种对与错的那种感觉

There is a feeling of right and wrong.

就你功能上

In terms of your functions

你到底服务是

What service do you provide?

到底做没做到什么

What exactly has been accomplished?

就是普适的程度

It is the degree of universality.

我们都要有一个

We all need to have one.

就是大概的

It's about that.

大概其他标准

Other standards approximately.

如果你这方面做的不好的话

If you are not doing well in this regard.

首先你就

First, you should...

就要经历一波

It's about to go through a wave.

这个舆论的洗礼

The baptism of public opinion.

而且不只是舆论

And it's not just public opinion.

你让我玩难受

You make it hard for me to play.

我就真不玩了

I'm really not going to play anymore.

我就不充钱了

I'm not going to spend money anymore.

我就走了

I'm leaving now.

那你咋的

Then what about you?

这不只是舆论问题

This is not just a matter of public opinion.

服务型游戏就是这样的

Service-oriented games are just like this.

而且它跟买端制最大的区别是

Moreover, the biggest difference between it and the purchase end system is

人家是不停的要改的

People keep needing to change.

就是你不停的要改

It's just that you keep wanting to change.

就是你

It's you.

你这个调率

You are so annoying.

大伙觉得太低了

Everyone thinks it's too low.

你就得提高

You just have to improve.

因为大伙都骂你

Because everyone is cursing at you.

完了你真的就会改

You will really change after it's over.

它没有说一个定型的

It didn't say a fixed form.

给你刻张盘

I'll make a disc for you.

给你的这回事

This matter for you.

服务型游戏

Service-oriented games

它就是一个在线上的东西

It is just something that is online.

如果一个玩家群体

If a group of players

它就是以服务型游戏

It is a service-oriented game.

就是它最开始玩游戏

It is the first to play the game.

就是玩这些东西

It's just about playing with these things.

玩很多年下来

After playing for many years.

那它当然就会有这个要求了

Then it will certainly have this requirement.

我觉得这倒也正常

I think that's quite normal.

但是就是它回到

But it just returned.

像黑人化这样的

Like blackface.

买端制游戏的时候

When buying end-game content.

它会有不适应

It will have discomfort.

所以它就是

So it is.

就是提出这样的要求

It's just putting forward such a request.

当然这个

Of course this.

你不能把这个和

You can't compare this with

你实际这游戏

You actually this game

有可改进的地方混为一谈

Mistakenly conflating areas for improvement.

是

Yes

你就说

Just say it.

反正挑这游戏不好的

Anyway, it's not good to choose this game.

那都是玩

That's all just play.

玩他们课金手游的人渣

Scum who play their pay-to-win mobile games.

那我看不起你

Then I look down on you.

我觉得你这种说法

I think your statement is like this.

这种说法就是纯

This statement is purely.

你为什么老把我推到

Why do you always push me away?

特别合的那个角度

The angle that fits especially well.

对吧

That's right.

就是你比如说

For example, you might say...

你这个

You this

你这个游戏

This game of yours.

让我刷那个什么种

Let me swipe that kind of thing.

你老刷不出来

You can't keep doing it.

是

Yes

就是你没有一个

It's just that you don't have one.

就是你刷到多少个

How many have you scrolled through?

你就给我得了

Just give it to me.

对

Yes.

我跟他聊这个事的时候

When I talked to him about this matter.

他提出一个

He proposed one.

我完全就是

I completely am.

我完全没有认知的一个概念

A concept that I have no understanding of at all.

这有啥不能改的呢

What can't be changed about this?

加低保

Add social security benefits.

对

Yes.

他说你这玩意这有低保

He said this thing of yours has basic living allowance here.

我说

I said.

这个词都没在我脑子里

This word is not even in my mind.

蹦出来过

Jumped out.

保底

Guaranteed bottom line.

我并不是说这个事得有保底

I'm not saying that there has to be a guaranteed minimum for this matter.

而是说就是它可以有

But it can have.

反正我不管怎么着

Anyway, I won't care one way or another.

就是你比如说

For example, you could say...

如果你是一个暗黑破坏神

If you are a Diablo.

玩你在这刷那个

Play with you while brushing that.

什么玩意

What is this thing?

我也不懂

I don't understand either.

就是

That's it.

大迷信还是什么

Is it a big superstition or what?

你的意思就是

What you mean is

他玩的就是这个

This is what he plays.

对

Correct.

那就不可能有保底

Then there can't be any guarantee.

我也不可能提这要求

I also can't make this request.

你玩的就是没了

What you played is gone.

刷完以后

After brushing.

你刷上来的东西词条

The items you posted have entries.

完了结构最复杂

The most complex structure is finished.

完了就是会不断的改变

What is finished will constantly change.

你build的那个想法跟路线

The idea and plan you built.

那这个游戏

Then this game

就是这个游戏的点

This is the point of the game.

那你黑人化是玩这个吗

So you're trying to be black by playing this?

你让我刷那个

You want me to swipe that.

什么什么偶

What what偶

或者什么玩意呢

Or what the hell is it?

刷那种子

Brush that seed.

刷那个泡酒物

Brush that soaking item.

你是为了

You are for

让我们要没了刷吗

Shall we stop scrolling?

你游戏的这个点是在这吗

Is this the point of your game?

肯定不是吧

Definitely not.

对

Yes.

所以你

So you.

如果在这个时候

If at this moment

你拿出你婆罗门的那套说

You take out your set of Brahman and say.

哎呦

Oh dear.

这个买断制游戏

This buyout system game

我们就是这样

This is how we are.

我们自古以来就是这样

We have always been like this since ancient times.

我们

We

最好有视频

It's best to have a video.

太可惜没有视频了

It's such a pity there is no video.

就是我们就从来没有

It's just that we have never...

保底是你们那个

The minimum guarantee is yours.

持续运营类玩家的恶习

Habits of players in continuous operation.

我觉得这就是傻逼

I think this is nonsense.

不是

No.

我们不知道什么叫保底

We don't know what a guaranteed bottom means.

就是这个问题

That's the problem.

这个是很奇妙的一个事

This is a very marvelous thing.

就他玩过这游戏

He has played this game.

他一第一反应

His first reaction.

我的第一反应是

My first reaction is

你压根就不应该做这种几率的东西

You shouldn't be doing such probabilistic things at all.

你就在所有的那个偶的点

You are at the point of all those偶.

中间设计一个特殊的偶点

Design a special even point in the middle.

就这点

That's all.

出的不受

Not accepted.

你的意思就是不按该率

What you mean is not to follow that rate.

算作一个探索

Count as an exploration.

你可以把它藏在隐秘一点也好

You can hide it a little more secretly.

什么也好

Anything is fine.

就是算是一个收集要素就完了

It's just a matter of collecting the elements, and that's it.

探索要素就完了

The exploration elements are complete.

你这种细腻

Your delicate nature.

你就没有

You don't have it.

你就多愚弄那种

You just keep fooling that kind of person.

什么怪物掉落这种东西

What kind of monster drops this kind of thing?

我也不太理解

I don't quite understand either.

为什么你不想让我得到这个东西呢

Why don't you want me to have this thing?

是啊

Yes.

就是说为什么呢

That is to say, why is that?

为什么呢

Why is that?

对你做了

Did it to you.

他为什么不给我

Why doesn't he give it to me?

你要有原因就可以

You can do it as long as you have a reason.

就如果你实在

Just if you really do.

你这游戏确实有一个原因

There is indeed a reason for your game.

就是让人没了没了的刷这个

It's just something that makes people disappear when they scroll through it.

会导致一种新的乐趣

It will lead to a new kind of pleasure.

因为有很多的游戏类型

Because there are many types of games.

就是什么装备驱动类

It is equipment drive type.

它就是这样

That's how it is.

如果你有这个

If you have this

那我就没问题

Then I have no problem.

就不可能再有人挑你一个理

Then no one will be able to pick on you again.

你看你说有原因这个事

You see, you mentioned there is a reason for this matter.

就是它是一个逻辑上

It is logically.

按照你说游戏设计上

According to what you said about game design.

你给我一个理由

Give me a reason.

这个就是特别

This is particularly special.

因为我觉得

Because I feel that

就在我认知里

In my perception.

就是做电子游戏这里头

It’s about making video games.

就有一些东西是没道理的

Some things just don't make sense.

就是做游戏这个人

It's the person who makes games.

我就要

I want it.

我就想这样

I just want it this way.

那也可以

That works too.

就是如果在美学上

It is just that in terms of aesthetics.

美学上有原因也可以

There are also aesthetic reasons.

有你创造意图上也

There is also your creative intention.

就是你能说出个一二三来都可以

As long as you can say one, two, three, that's fine.

我想讹讹你

I want to trick you.

也

also

也是一种原因

It is also one of the reasons.

不是说非得在那个什么游戏策划的那个学术上

It's not like you have to be in some kind of academic thing about game design.

就是说我做策划就得这么做

That is to say, as a planner, I have to do it this way.

并不是这个狭义上的逻辑

It is not this narrow sense of logic.

你只要有逻辑

You just need to be logical.

我就想在游戏里加一点吧

I just want to add a little bit in the game.

就是也没啥影响

It doesn't really have any impact.

但是有些人运气好

But some people are lucky.

诶

Hey.

就是这个偶然发现

It's this偶然发现.

这玩意儿还有东西呢

This thing still has stuff in it.

我就想加点这种

I just want to add some of this.

这个给一部分人

This is for a certain group of people.

有缘分的人

People with a connection.

加点这种意外的小乐趣

Add a little unexpected fun.

对

Yes.

然后你给人做到九九八十一难的成就里

Then you achieve the monumental success of the eighty-one trials.

对

Yes.

这事就是多了一层问题

This matter has one more layer of problems.

就龙马刚才说的

Regarding what Longma just said.

你自己非要拿这个全成就

You insist on achieving this all by yourself.

那是不是

Is that so?

如果你想拿全成就

If you want to achieve 100% completion.

我怎么难为你都不过分

No matter how I make things difficult for you, it’s not too much.

但是对于那些不追求这个事的人

But for those who do not pursue this matter.

有没有影响

Is there an impact?

就是可以了

That's it.

那照你这么说

Then according to what you said,

我就不应该矫情这个事

I shouldn't be so delicate about this matter.

是吧

Is that so?

所以我也不是

So I am not either.

我在自省这个事

I am reflecting on this matter.

就是我对于这个事的要求也变高

My requirements for this matter have also become higher.

和这个接受度也变低了

And this acceptance level has also decreased.

我在想我以前

I am thinking about my past.

就是特别可能十几二十年的时候游戏

It probably refers to games from ten to twenty years ago.

我对游戏里那种特别没道理的

I'm really frustrated with the completely unreasonable things in the game.

那种制作人的一些傻逼坚持

The ridiculous insistence of some producers.

或者是胡闹的东西

Or it’s something silly.

如人度特别高

If a person's level is particularly high.

那个时候

At that time.

就觉得好像电视里都有这玩意

It just feels like this thing is everywhere on TV.

嗯

Uh-huh.

好像是

It seems like it.

他现在这个时代

This era he is in now.

我也接受

I accept it too.

但是你还是

But you still...

你还是有道理的

You are still right.

可以讲的

Can be spoken.

你不是毫无道理

You are not entirely unreasonable.

就PS3那个时候你刷奖杯

Back in the PS3 days when you were unlocking trophies.

就那个奖杯如果太简单

If the trophy is too simple.

我反而会觉得有问题

I would rather feel that there is a problem.

就是啊

That's right.

这个地方是

This place is

每个游戏里都会有那么奖杯

Every game will have those trophies.

有那么一两个奖杯

There are one or two trophies.

所以会有白金神座这个词吗

So is there the term "Platinum Throne"?

特别变态

Especially perverted.

嗯

Hmm.

啊

Ah.

就是特别接受这事

Just especially accept this matter.

我就我现在

I just am who I am now.

我那天在刷一成就时候

I was completing an achievement that day.

我发现我已经不接受这个事了

I have found that I can no longer accept this.

嗯

Um.

就是你可以弄一boss男

You can get a boss guy.

让我练这个boss

Let me practice this boss.

我可以

I can.

但你说能不能让我踩那藕

But can you let me step on that lotus root?

然后

Then

纯垃圾之间

Pure garbage among each other.

啊

Ah

我就特生气

I'm really angry.

对

Yes.

萌生出一种特别

A special feeling has emerged.

特别生气的那个情绪

The emotion of being particularly angry.

我觉得这事里

I think in this matter.

没有什么绝对的对和错

There is no absolute right or wrong.

就并不是说这个

It doesn't mean that.

你敢要求我

Do you dare to ask me?

你就必须要

You just have to.

多少把以内得给我

Please give me within how many pairs.

嗯

Uh-huh.

我也不是这个观点

I don't hold this viewpoint either.

但我觉得这事是非常非常小的

But I think this matter is actually very, very minor.

就是在评价黑人化这个游戏里

It's about evaluating the game of blackening.

是

Yes

这话题完全不值一提

This topic is totally not worth mentioning.

就是但是你今天不是要

It's just that you don't want to today.

你今儿就想聊这个

You want to talk about this today.

两个世界摩擦产生的一些

Some conflicts arising from the friction between two worlds.

对

Correct.

这个现在的

This now.

认知冲突

Cognitive conflict

对包括我自己也有变化

There have also been changes, including for myself.

对这个事

About this matter.

就保底确实是一个

The bottom line is indeed one.

因为这个事的本质

Because of the nature of this matter.

它不是那个概率

It's not that probability.

真概率假概率

True probability and false probability.

就是哪个是绝对对和绝对错的问题

It's a question of what is absolutely right and absolutely wrong.

而是你卖给我什么东西的问题

It's a matter of what you are selling to me.

你现在你收我280块钱

You now owe me 280 yuan.

卖给我一个游戏

Sell me a game.

里面有一些东西可以刷出来

There are some things that can be brushed out.

我买的不是刷的那个东西

What I bought is not that brush thing.

我买的是黑人化这个拷贝嘛

I bought this copy of "Blackface," right?

就我买的是这个游戏嘛

Well, I bought this game.

所以这个时候

So at this time

这个你愿意咋整就咋整

You can do whatever you like with this.

好像没有太多人矫情这个事

It seems like not too many people are being pretentious about this matter.

对对对

Yes, yes, yes.

就是你愿意咋整就咋整

It's up to you how you want to handle it.

但是我也有权利说

But I also have the right to say.

你让我刷这个

You want me to swipe this.

这个嫩鱼藕

This tender fish and lotus root.

就是过了

Just passed.

这是我的权利

This is my right.

我可以说吧

Can I speak?

对吧

Right?

但我承认

But I admit.

这是这个评价这游戏里面

This is the evaluation of this game.

微不足道的一个事

A trivial matter.

但是呢

However,

抽卡手游里面就不是这样

It's not like this in gacha mobile games.

因为抽卡手游里

Because in gacha mobile games

我买的不是这个游戏

I didn't buy this game.

就我买的不是原神

I didn't buy Genshin Impact.

绝去联络什么玩意

Absolutely cut off contact with whatever it is.

我买的就是那个武器

I bought that weapon.

那武器你得给我

You have to give me that weapon.

那武器不是

That weapon is not.

那你都说了

Then you said it all.

你说了百分之多少的概率

What percentage of probability did you mention?

完了你要是没保底的话

If you don't have a guaranteed minimum, then it's all over.

你就犯法了呀

You have violated the law.

你这个各国家

You, this country of various nations.

这个事都已经是违法的了

This matter is already illegal.

就是在十几年前

It was more than ten years ago.

可能还有那个所谓的真概率

There may also be that so-called true probability.

真概率游戏

True Probability Game

好像很早就开始

It seems to have started a long time ago.

对不对

Is that correct?

就被骂没了

Just got scolded and disappeared.

对啊

That's right.

他一定得

He must.

就是哪怕没有这个要求的时候

Even if there is no requirement for this.

游戏有隐性的

The game has hidden aspects.

为了他的军户体验

For his military household experience.

他也要隐性的做这个

He also wants to do this covertly.

对啊

That's right.

这是关于一个商业诚信的问题

This is a question about business integrity.

就是你卖给我一个东西

You sell me something.

只不过是不是一手交钱

It's just that the payment is not made in full upfront.

一手交货

Cash on delivery.

而是那个让我玩一个

It's the one that lets me play one.

玩一个轮番赌博的

Play a round of gambling.

这么一个机制

Such a mechanism.

但我确实还是在花一笔钱

But I am indeed spending a sum of money.

买一个东西

Buy an item.

这个价格不能是无限高的

This price cannot be infinitely high.

这个价格不能是人民币一个亿

This price cannot be one hundred million yuan.

对吧

Right?

不能吧

No way.

你咱都说好

We both agreed.

所以最高

So the highest.

就理论上他也不能

In theory, he can't either.

对理论上也不能

It cannot be done in theory either.

对

Correct.

你必须用机制

You must use the mechanism.

去保证他不能超过某个数

Go ensure that he cannot exceed a certain number.

就是真概率这个问题

It's about the issue of true probability.

就是你要是说

If you say

游戏就设计成这样

The game is designed this way.

然后你要有道理

Then you need to be reasonable.

那可以

That works.

但是你也要知道

But you also need to know.

就是但其实绝大多数游戏

However, the vast majority of games...

完全不产生这种

Completely does not produce this.

太规模的问题

The issue of scale.

这个问题其实太微小了

This problem is actually too trivial.

但是一个游戏卖一千多万套

But a game sells over ten million copies.

你一千多万套

You have over ten million sets.

一个东西

a thing

如果暴率是1%

If the incidence rate is 1%

不管是百分之多少

No matter what percentage it is.

百分之X的话

If it's X percent.

你把它化成那个

You turned it into that.

正态分布的曲线

Normal distribution curve

那个中型曲线

That medium-sized curve.

你懂吧

Do you understand?

就是那个

That's the one.

就是那个抽一把就出的人

It's the one that shows up after just one draw.

占这个事百分之多少

What percentage does this account for?

然后他有一个那个期望

Then he has that expectation.

对吧

Right?

这个中型曲线的

This medium curve's

那个最右边

The one on the far right.

总是会有几个傻逼的

There will always be a few idiots.

就是特别倒霉蛋的

It's just a particularly unlucky person.

就特别惨的那个人

That especially unfortunate person.

那你想让他死吗

So, do you want him to die?

如果他就想刷这成就的话

If he just wants to chase this achievement.

他都老了

He is getting old.

他刷五年刷不来

He can't get it even after five years of trying.

这事有意义吗

Does this matter?

因为你卖了一千万套

Because you sold ten million sets.

就必保有那么

Then it must be guaranteed.

有那么几百个人

There are several hundred people.

他一定要遭这个罪的

He must suffer this punishment.

那我觉得这个

Then I think this.

没有啥道理

There is no reason for that.

特别特别早期的网络

The very early internet.

现在真有这个事

There really is this matter now.

就是某种世界里

It's in some kind of world.

有些东西

Some things

刷凤凰吗

Are you brushing the phoenix?

我到现在没出呢

I haven't gone out yet.

刷多少遍都不出

No matter how many times I brush, it won't come out.

一周三次

Three times a week.

他那是真概率是吧

That's probably real probability, right?

对啊

Yeah.

他就没有保底

He doesn't have a guaranteed bottom line.

因为他有的

Because he has it.

一个是装备驱动类游戏

One is an equipment-driven game.

人家就玩的就这个

That's just what they play.

另外还有一类

There is also another category.

就是你不能说人家

You just can't talk about others like that.

就是那个多人游戏里边

It's in that multiplayer game.

有设计公平

Design for fairness.

有的事是设计

Some things are designed.

那个你跟别人比的

That, which you compare with others.

但你单机游戏

But you play single-player games.

你这个你也不设计

You didn't even design this.

是

Yes.

但是中心老师

But the central teacher

刚才已经把这个例子

I just gave this example.

举到头了

Lifted to the head.

就是那个服务型游戏里面

It's in that service-oriented game.

最服务最服务的

The most service-oriented.

不就是这个

Isn't it just this?

什么出卡手游这一类

What is a card-issuing mobile game like this?

但是我是觉得

But I feel that...

这个所谓的

This so-called

咱们今天聊这个服务性游戏

Let's talk about this service-oriented game today.

它不是一个极端的事

It is not an extreme thing.

就是说现在单机游戏里

That is to say, in single-player games now.

也在做服务性内容

Also creating service-oriented content.

对

Yes.

这个服务是比较紧的

This service is relatively tight.

我是想说

I want to say.

就这种类型的游戏

Just this type of game.

除了跟他同一竞赛道的竞品以外

Except for competing products that are on the same competition track as him.

其实他对整个

In fact, he is quite concerned about the whole thing.

有玩家对游戏的认知

Understanding of the game by players.

都是有影响

All have an impact.

没错

That's right.

一直到这个事

Until this matter.

大家开始玩这种游戏之后

Everyone started playing this kind of game.

然后认识到原来

Then realizing that originally

游戏有哪些哪些地方

What places are there in the game?

是应该

It should be.

有一些

There are some.

就像是标准似的

It's just like a standard.

都应该把这些地方做好

These places should all be improved.

而这些东西

And these things

不是说你的品位

It's not about your taste.

不是说你游戏的风格

It's not about the style of your game.

而是

but rather

以前会把它

It used to put it.

我们把识别成

We identify as

就是有这个游戏开发者的选择

It's just the choice of the game developer.

现在玩家不这么认为

Players don't think that way now.

就是创作自由的那个领域

It is the realm of creative freedom.

在受到

Under the influence

那个因为大众的

That is because of the public.

这个服务型游戏的广泛

The widespread nature of this service-oriented game.

长期实践形成的

Formed through long-term practice.

工序良俗的

The customs of the process

就是那个习俗在挤压你的创作空间

It is that custom that is constraining your creative space.

那个习俗变得越来越坚硬了

That custom has become increasingly rigid.

因为人家就说

Because people just said

我长这么大

I've grown up this big.

我没坚硬

I am not hard.

我就没保底的东西

I don't have anything that is guaranteed.

就没有

Just none.

没有这样

There is no such thing.

你不行

You can't do it.

你必须

You must.

有这种情况

There is such a situation.

尤其是你

Especially you.

就是可能一直玩手游

It’s probably just playing mobile games all the time.

成长起来的新一代的玩家

The new generation of players who have grown up.

他会觉得没有保底

He will feel that there is no safety net.

耍流氓就是

Being a rogue means

对对

Yes, yes.

没有这样

Not like this.

就犯法

It is against the law.

你听说游戏叫FGO吗

Have you heard of a game called FGO?

FGO

FGO

知道

Know

这游戏好像是我玩了五年

This game feels like I've been playing for five years.

但是什么明日方舟

But what is Arknights?

什么的

What kind of thing?

后来都出来了

Later, they all came out.

就是手游有自己的一套

Mobile games have their own set of rules.

那个保底也好的

That guarantee is also good.

这套商业逻辑了

This set of business logic.

FGO到后来

FGO until later

还是坚持没有保底

Still insist there is no guarantee.

而且抽卡几率贼低

Moreover, the card pull rates are really low.

就是一个坚持做自己的

It is about坚持做自己.

这么一个游戏

Such a game.

依照现在吗

According to now?

不可能

Impossible

太久不玩了

Haven't played for a long time.

不知道

I don't know.

现在肯定有保底

There is definitely a bottom line now.

我知道一些国家

I know some countries.

就是会直接

It will be direct.

就是从代码级别

It is from the code level.

如果你没有保底

If you don't have a bottom line.

就不合法

It's illegal.

对

Correct.

他就是

He is.

就是因为他不

It's precisely because he doesn't.

他的定义是一种特殊的

His definition is a kind of special.

就是交互方式

It’s just the interaction method.

但是他的本质

But his essence.

是我花钱买

I bought it with my money.

我要抽的那个东西

The thing I want to draw.

只不过这价格是浮动的

The price is just variable.

他有一个价格歧视

He has a price discrimination.

就有一浮动价格

There is a floating price.

那价格理论上

That price theoretically

不能超过一数

Cannot exceed one.

关于商品的价格

Regarding the price of the goods.

各个国家都有法律

Every country has laws.

咱们国家也有

Our country also has it.

如果你那个没有

If you don't have that.

保底的话

Guaranteed words.

理论上你那个

In theory, your thing.

确实犯法

It is indeed illegal.

因为他有

Because he has

理论上他有可能超过

In theory, he could surpass.

法律规定的合理价格

Reasonable price as stipulated by law.

这个范畴

This category

对

Correct.

但是话说来

But speaking of which

买断制的游戏里边

In games with a buyout system.

就没有不涉及这个

There's nothing that doesn't involve this.

因为我就是买这个游戏

Because I just bought this game.

但是确实

But indeed.

你之前

You before.

你跟我提过一些例子

You mentioned some examples to me.

比如说像一路神剑这种

For example, something like "One Road Divine Sword."

对

Correct.

内部抽卡

Internal draw card

一路神剑里就安排一些

Some arrangements in the journey of the divine sword.

就是纯纯的抽卡环节

It's just a pure gacha segment.

对

Yes.

我不知道

I don't know.

当时我玩

At that time, I was playing.

我是就是特别没必要

I really don't think it's necessary.

我觉得

I think.

刷黑人

Brush Black People

我是觉得他是一种

I feel that he is a kind of...

这种核心用户

This type of core user.

能理解的

Understandable.

方式

Method

一种反补

A counter-supplement.

就是说

That is to say.

因为很多人从小到大

Because many people have grown up.

就可能

Just possible.

他就是玩这种抽卡游戏

He just plays this kind of card-drawing game.

长大的

Grown up.

这就是他最容易理解的一种

This is the kind that he can understand the easiest.

我获得了强力

I have gained strength.

道具资源和角色的方式

The way of props, resources, and characters.

那哪怕他不涉及钱

Even if he is not involved with money.

我也把这个形式保留下来

I also kept this form.

让他去理解这件事

Let him understand this matter.

因为那个游戏

Because of that game.

好像主要一个问题

It seems to be mainly one problem.

是那个抽卡

It’s that draw card.

他那个互动交互

His interactive interaction.

做的特别繁琐

It is particularly complicated to do.

是

Yes

都这个年代了

It's already this era.

你竟然要想整这玩意

You actually want to deal with this thing.

首先我不明白

First of all, I don't understand.

你弄这玩意

What are you doing with this thing?

你也不挣这钱

You're not earning this money either.

所有

All

不卖卡的

Not selling cards.

为啥要抽呢

Why do you want to draw?

一度神剑里抽了张卡

Once, I drew a card from the Divine Sword.

其实我感觉

Actually, I feel that…

跟刷刷装备

Upgrade equipment.

掉没掉装备

Did you drop any equipment?

差不多一个意思

Almost the same meaning.

他最早那个版本

His earliest version.

甚至没有十连抽

Not even a ten consecutive draw.

我没记错的话

If I remember correctly.

他一个一个抽

He draws them one by one.

抽了好几百回

I've drawn hundreds of times.

就有病了

Just got sick.

后来改上有事

Later, there was something to attend to.

那我也觉得有病了

Then I think I must be sick too.

反正我就是

Anyway, it's just me.

我特别讨厌几率这个事

I particularly dislike the concept of probability.

即使这种日式的RPG

Even this kind of Japanese RPG

它在难为你的事上

It is difficult for you.

也没有难为到

It’s not that difficult either.

就是说你要是不抽

That means if you don't smoke.

到一定程度

To a certain extent.

过不了关的程度

The level that cannot pass the threshold.

所以我当时就完全不盖的

So I didn't cover it at all at that time.

我就打通关

I just want to clear the levels.

我就完了

I'm done.

我就根本就

I just simply don't.

一度神剑二

Once Upon a Time with the Divine Sword II

那抽黑人

That draws a black person.

抽那什么铲球者

Draw that what shovel player.

对对对

Exactly, exactly.

甚至是抽最磕碜的

Even the most awkward ones.

和没得

And nothing.

对那个比小公子厉害

That one is more powerful than the young master.

有点怪

A bit strange.

对那稍微有点怪

That's a bit strange.

但是在游戏系统设计

But in game system design

有问题

There is a problem.

说回来

Speaking of which,

说到那个就是服务

Speaking of that, it's service.

这个事

This matter.

就是我发现

I found out that

好多游戏的点

A lot of game points.

是我以前

It was me before.

没这么想过

I never thought about it like that.

但现在因为就是服务

But now it's because of the service.

因为服务这个事

Because of the matter of service.

服务型游戏

Service-type games

就是在任何地方都服务你

It's about serving you anywhere.

包括你能意识到的

Including what you can be aware of.

一些功能性上的

Some functional aspects.

和一些你意识不到的系统

and some systems you are not aware of

对

Yes

辑情上的

Emotional.

就是给他写剧本的人

It's the person who writes the script for him.

也在想

Also thinking.

我怎么样就是提供正向的

I just provide positivity.

你对你来说

For you.

是好的情绪价值

It is a positive emotional value.

所以包括现在一些

So including some now.

很多单机游戏

Many single-player games.

可能会

It may.

有一些不那么

There are some not so...

那什么的

What the hell.

冲突的东西非常多

There are many conflicting things.

不那么服务的剧情

A plot that is not so service-oriented.

就他可能想表达点啥

He might want to express something.

可能里面印含了一些

It might contain some.

不那么就是积极的情绪

Not so much is a positive emotion.

可能有一些痛苦的

It might be a little painful.

或者不能

Or maybe not.

可能这个

Maybe this.

我知道你的意思

I know what you mean.

这种的

This kind of.

然后玩家也不接受了

Then the players also did not accept it.

就是我玩游戏

It's just that I'm playing a game.

就是

That's it.

咱不能说图爽吧

We can't just say it's for pleasure, right?

我尽管图个书

I am trying to get a book.

心放松

Relax your heart.

对

Correct.

就是习俗和艺术表达的边界

It is the boundary between customs and artistic expression.

正在像

Currently like

像那个艺术表达的腹地

Like the hinterland of that artistic expression.

在缓缓移动

Moving slowly.

对对对

Exactly, exactly!

你不能轻易的

You can't easily...

就是包括你像

It includes you like...

龙之星堂二这种游戏

Dragon Star Hall type II games.

我是我知道有些人玩家

I know that some people are players.

会不太接受他

They may not accept him very well.

这个我理解

I understand this.

但是有些人就跟

But some people are like

恨的恨不得杀的

Hate to the point of wanting to kill.

那个音简

That sound is simple.

去骂去骂这个游戏

Go criticize this game.

这个这个是我

This is me.

这个是我

This is me.

就是有点get不到的

Just a bit hard to get.

就说这游戏

Let's talk about this game.

就是不知道

Just don't know.

我不知道

I don't know.

就是

That's it.

今天你想聊的是一个

Today, what you want to talk about is a

两个地方交叠的

The overlap of two places.

那叠上的那块东西

That thing on top of the stack.

我意思

I mean.

意识到

Realize

这个东西可以是设计

This thing can be design.

也可以是糟粕

It can also be dregs.

但是有的人觉得

But some people think that

它是设计

It is design.

有人觉得是糟粕

Some people think it's trash.

这个事你让我说

This matter, you want me to talk about.

我也说不出个

I can't say for sure either.

就是说怎么样情况下

It means under what circumstances.

它就算

It counts as it is.

算糟粕

Calculate the dregs.

因为习俗并不是一个

Because customs are not a single entity.

官方机构认可的

Officially recognized by the authorities.

就是这个现在定了

It's this one that is confirmed now.

电子游戏从今往后

Video games from now on.

这个对啊

That's right.

掉落必须给我这么做

Dropping must be done like this for me.

不就是人走的多了

Isn't it just that more people have left?

就成了路的这个问题

It became the issue of the road.

你的路比我路宽

Your road is wider than mine.

你游戏不让我传送

You're not letting me teleport in the game.

万字文骂你

A ten-thousand-character essay scolding you.

这不就是hard fun

Isn't this just hard fun?

难做的原因吗

The reason it's hard to do?

就是作者想给你提供点hard fun

The author wants to provide you with some hard fun.

想让你

I want you.

来点挑战

Bring on some challenges.

然后让你感受到

Then let you feel.

延迟满足之后的

After delayed gratification.

更大的那种喜悦

A greater kind of joy.

但是可能这块一旦没做好

But if this part is not done well...

就变成了

It became.

现在玩家口中所说的

What players are talking about now

太愤

Too angry.

恶心人

Disgusting person.

不玩了

Not playing anymore.

骂街

Street cursing

包括法环难度那个事

Including the difficulty of the Ring of Law.

也是

Also.

这个事我都想不到

I never thought of this.

会有人会骂这个事

Some people will criticize this matter.

因为在我认识里

Because in my understanding.

有的游戏就是比较难

Some games are just quite difficult.

有的游戏就是很简单

Some games are just very simple.

这不就好像是仿佛

Isn't that just like it seems?

天经地义的

The way of heaven and earth.

就是游戏有不同类型

There are different types of games.

单机游戏的强度平衡

The balance of difficulty in single-player games.

是典型的那个

It is the typical one.

买断制意

Buyout system intention

世界内的习俗

Customs within the world

就是比如说

For example,

你法环DLC出了

Your Elden Ring DLC is out.

完了调一遍

Finished adjusting once.

武器强弱

Weapon strength and weakness.

新出的武器会更好

The newly released weapons will be better.

完了调完了

It's done and adjusted.

再调一遍

Adjust it again.

就是官方

It's official.

你也不知道为啥

You don't even know why.

他有时候他调的

Sometimes he adjusts it.

跟玩家社区的体感

The tactile experience with the player community.

就完全不一样

It's completely different.

你不知道他为啥调

You don't know why he adjusted.

但是也没有人说

But no one said either.

是我不行

It's my fault.

我起诉你

I am suing you.

我弄死你

I will kill you.

你把我的什么什么剑

You took my something something sword.

就给削了

Just get it cut off.

我怎么递你

How do I hand it to you?

就还是我说那个问题

Then it's still the question I mentioned.

有一部分的因素

There are some factors.

是可以用这个逻辑来解释

It can be explained using this logic.

就是因为你买的是

It's just because you bought it.

那个游戏的拷贝

The copy of that game.

你

You

我

I

你买的是

What you bought is

那整个这个地图

That whole map.

和整个这所有的体验

and the whole experience of it all

那个有武器

That one has weapons.

是打包在里边的

It is packed inside.

但是里边涉及了

But it involves inside.

那个不额外收你钱的

That one doesn't charge you extra.

那个PVP

That PVP.

完了你可能觉得

You might feel that it's over.

我这build

My build

我用的习惯了

I'm used to it.

完了你削了以后

After you peel it.

你伤害了我的利益

You have harmed my interests.

但这个事很难成为一个

But this matter is difficult to become a...

就是说

That is to say.

就我要冲垮你

I'm going to overwhelm you.

from software

from software

因为我买的不是

Because what I bought is not.

蓝腿那个武器

The blue-legged weapon.

那个技能招

That skill move.

对

Yes.

但是在服务型游戏里面

But in service-oriented games

这就完全是相反的

This is completely the opposite.

就完全是构成

It is entirely composed of.

对啊

Yeah.

我买的东西

The things I bought.

你敢看我买过的东西

Do you dare to look at the things I have bought?

因为我买的就是这武器

Because the weapon I bought is this one.

你敢削我这武器

Do you dare to dull this weapon of mine?

是

Yes

对这个事在MMO里

Regarding this matter in the MMO.

都没有曾经

Nothing exists anymore.

是

Yes

摩托世界里

In the world of motorcycles.

其实它该削啥削啥

Actually, it should peel whatever it needs to peel.

因为大家付费

Because everyone pays.

还是那个游戏时间

It's still that game time.

你买的够买游戏时间

You have bought enough game time.

对

Yes.

看你卖的我是什么

I want to see what you are selling.

对

Correct.

你要敢卖给我一个

You have to dare to sell me one.

什么弹刀

What is a弹刀?

完了你再给我削弱一下

After you're done, weaken it a bit more for me.

对

Correct.

甚至就出现这种情况

Such a situation has even occurred.

就是说

That is to say.

也不是削弱

It's not about weakening either.

就是原来有一bug

There was originally a bug.

就这

That's it.

这武器有一个

This weapon has one.

有一个

There is a.

N法

N methods

它有一个特殊bug

It has a special bug.

就会特别强

It will be particularly strong.

这你也不能修

You can't fix this either.

就是你要是

It's just that if you...

你要第一天修可以

You can fix it on the first day.

就是你刚出来以后

It's just after you came out.

就发现

Just discovered.

这是一bug

This is a bug.

你马上修可以

You can fix it right away.

你要等了一段时间

You will have to wait for a while.

你再修

You fix it again.

你就死吧

You might as well die.

就是你比如说

For example, you say.

你等了一年

You waited for a year.

你突然间

You suddenly.

那个就是

That is it.

大喘气出来

Take a big breath.

这个bug得修一下

This bug needs to be fixed.

绝对干死你

Absolutely going to kill you.

这让我想起了

This reminds me of.

前段时间

Some time ago

好像上个月

It seems like last month.

停服的一个手游

A mobile game that has been discontinued.

叫环形战争

Called Circular War.

那游戏做的特有个性

That game has a very unique personality.

就是你

It's you.

就是玩家付费买的角色会死

The characters that players pay for will die.

然后制作人就不改

Then the producer just won't change it.

然后玩家说

Then the player said.

我花钱买的角色

The character I bought with money.

为什么会死呢

Why do we die?

这你得改

You need to change this.

然后那个游戏就停服了

Then the game was taken offline.

我花真金白银买的人

The person I bought with real money.

你给我弄死了

You've got me killed.

不是

No.

这个事不是应该

This matter should not be.

你买的时候

When you buy it.

我就告诉你的话

I just told you.

这个事就不算耍流氓了

This matter can no longer be considered as messing around.

不知道

I don't know.

没发生过这个

This has never happened.

你怎么告诉呢

How do you tell?

你就是在决策设定里

You are in the decision-making settings.

写上这人以后会死

Write that this person will die later.

不知道

I don't know.

游戏系统

Game system

你就告诉我们

Just tell us.

对游戏是个什么机制

What kind of mechanism is there for the game?

你买的这个东西

The thing you bought.

是个会消耗掉的东西

It is something that can be consumed.

不懂

Don't understand.

我觉得这个

I think this.

那可能就压根就没人玩了

Then maybe no one will play at all.

就没有这先例

There is no precedent for this.

不知道该

Don't know what to do.

刚才你们提到龙神仙人2

You just mentioned the Dragon Immortal 2.

我想插一嘴

I want to interject.

问一个

Ask a question.

就是我个人的一个疑问

It's just a personal question of mine.

就比如说龙神仙人2

For example, Dragon God Immortal 2.

这个游戏

This game

我玩的时候有一个疑问

I have a question while playing.

就如果说

Just say if

这个游戏里边有一个缺陷

There is a flaw in this game.

玩家承认

The player admits.

官方自己也承认

The authorities also admit it themselves.

然后有一个第三方

Then there is a third party.

做了一个差价

Made a price difference.

把这个遗憾弥补上了

Make up for this regret.

那玩家玩的时候

When the player is playing

会不会应该有一些作弊

Shouldn't there be some cheating?

或者说有一些愧疚

Or perhaps there is some guilt.

就是我没有体验到

I just didn't experience it.

这个游戏最原汁原味的东西

The most authentic aspect of this game.

想给你体验的那东西

The thing I want you to experience.

会吗

Can you?

比如说小仪图

For example, Xiao Yi's diagram.

玩家

Player

我觉得玩的人来讲

I think for those who play it.

然后官方也承认

Then the official also acknowledged.

我自己是不太会

I can't really do it myself.

有这个情绪

Have this emotion.

说我有点作弊

They say I am a bit cheating.

因为Max是完全get不到

Because Max completely doesn't get it.

龙神仙人2

Dragon God Immortal 2

任何乐趣的那种

Any kind of fun.

是吗

Is that so?

所以我挺想听他

So I really want to listen to him.

听你说说的

Tell me what you said.

傻呀

Silly!

我觉得挺好玩

I think it's quite fun.

你怎么这么说

Why do you say that?

不承认了

No longer admit it.

我就觉得传送那个道具

I just think about transmitting that item.

就是传送这东西

It's just transmitting this thing.

有点恶心人

A bit disgusting.

你想说这个

You want to say this.

连龙神仙人2

Connecting Dragon Immortal 2

你都不敢惹

You don't dare to provoke.

你敢惹谁

Who do you dare to mess with?

就是呀

That's right.

这么软的视频

Such a soft video.

都不捏你

I won't pinch you.

你捏呀

You pinch!

人都离职了

Everyone has resigned.

怕啥

What are you afraid of?

无知人

Ignorant person

其实昨天

Actually, yesterday.

你会不会觉得

Do you think that...?

一个事

One matter.

我问一下

Let me ask.

就是他那些

It's just his things.

有很多坚持

There are many坚持.

就是你能概算到

You can roughly estimate it.

游戏的有些乐趣

Some fun of the game

对吧

Right?

就是这个乐趣

That's the fun of it.

和他那些坚持

And his insistences.

其实没大关系

Actually, it doesn't matter much.

而且没有什么重合

And there is no overlap.

就你给我传送

Just send it to me.

我也不影响你乐趣

I won't affect your enjoyment either.

是吧

Really?

所以你这么想

So you think this way.

他那有些设定

He has some settings.

就非常没道理

It just doesn't make any sense.

就如果你要

Just if you want to.

你要是想揪问题

If you want to pick a fight.

那咱能就是揪到天荒地老

Then we can just hold on until the end of time.

那都是问题

That is all a problem.

那塞尔达200个传送点

There are 200 teleportation points in Zelda.

人也没说

No one said anything.

地图上有个人

There is a person on the map.

所以我们

So we

不想去塞尔达

I don't want to go to Zelda.

是吗

Is that so?

你看这就是

You see, this is it.

人和人的一个参词了

A comparison between people.

可以

Sure.

尊重理解

Respect and understanding.

上脾气开始

Start getting angry.

整体上

Overall

我会这么想这个问题

I will think about this issue like this.

就是他也不知道

He doesn't know either.

哪个事work

Which matter works?

就他脑子里

In his mind.

对这类游戏

Regarding this type of game.

他有一个

He has one.

就是脑子里

It's just in the brain.

龙心条说

Dragon Heart said.

我要有一个游戏

I want to have a game.

就是所有地方

It's everywhere.

要用脚跑

You need to run with your feet.

然后任务是

Then the task is

他那种奇特的

His peculiar kind of...

勾任方式

Methods of engagement.

你要一个人

You want to be alone.

一个人去靠嘴去问

A person goes to ask with their mouth.

然后他把这个游戏做出来

Then he made this game.

他不知道哪个事

He doesn't know which matter.

对于玩家来说

For players

是惊喜和那种发现感

It's the surprise and that sense of discovery.

他觉得

He thinks.

这就该这样

It should be like this.

他就把他想的

He just expressed what he thought.

那些特别硬的东西

Those particularly hard things.

都塞在这个游戏里

All stuffed in this game.

完了

It's over.

有一些对有些人work了

Some things worked for some people.

你看传送对你来说

You see, teleportation is for you.

无所谓

It doesn't matter.

对他来说

For him.

就是特别有用

It's just very useful.

就是你不让我传

It's just that you won't let me pass it on.

我就跑

I'll just run.

他觉得这是有用的

He thinks this is useful.

对我来说

For me

没有传送

No transmission.

这个事也不work

This thing doesn't work either.

还是得传送

Still needs to be transmitted.

我觉得这个没必要

I don't think this is necessary.

中间有好多

There are many in the middle.

实在是浪费时间

It's truly a waste of time.

好奇有些太远的地方

Curious about some places that are too far away.

还是得传

Still have to pass it on.

两个国家之间

Between two countries.

还是得传

Still have to pass it on.

你像我老说

You often tell me.

现在摩托世界传的太厉害

The motorcycle world is spreading too fiercely now.

就是人都不走路

It's just that people don't walk.

但是你说

But you said.

最早的摩托世界

The earliest motorcycle world

也是有飞行

There is also flying.

也是就是

That is to say.

他也不可能让你

He also cannot make you.

腿着跑全途的

Running with legs all the way.

对

Yes.

这也是龙人星庭2

This is also the Dragon Man Star Court 2.

我觉得你

I think you.

哪怕你增加我的移动速度也行

Even if you increase my movement speed, that would be fine.

但是你增加移动速度

But you increase movement speed.

那马车

That carriage.

然后你中途还总打得乱我

Then you always disrupt me in the middle.

对

Yes.

就有的时候

Sometimes

我真的是不想双脚跑

I really don’t want to run on foot.

这是我比较

This is what I prefer.

可以理解

Can understand.

对

Yes.

但是昨天龙马和斯帅

But yesterday Longma and Coach Si

跟我说这个选题的时候

When you talked to me about this topic.

就是说服务型游戏

That is to say, service-type games.

到底有没有

Is there or isn't there?

就是在这个时代

It is in this era.

作为一个妥协

As a compromise.

其实我想到的是

Actually, what I am thinking is...

英雄联盟的一个小点

A small point about League of Legends.

对你玩摩托

Playing with motorcycles.

对我特想听你说的

I really want to hear what you have to say.

竞技类游戏

Competitive games

然后我昨天晚上

Then I last night.

想了一晚上

Thought about it all night.

我觉得

I think.

我想先提出一个词

I would like to put forward a word first.

叫需求的阉割

Called the castration of demand.

这个我放在后面说

I'll talk about this later.

就是玩家的需求

It is the players' demand.

其实是在阉割

Actually, it is castration.

然后我觉得

Then I feel

就是这么多年

It's been all these years.

英雄联盟就改了这么多版

League of Legends has gone through so many versions.

然后玩家也说

Then the player also said.

英雄联盟下滑

League of Legends decline

我觉得

I think

这个问题还是服务型游戏

This question is still about service-oriented games.

它的核心在于服务玩家

Its core lies in serving the players.

其实它没有

Actually, it doesn't.

就是英雄联盟

It's League of Legends.

你要是真的研究下来

If you really study it...

发现这么多年

Discovered over the years.

它从来没有被

It has never been.

从来没有为玩家让步

Never compromised for the players.

它只不过就是

It's just that.

因为玩家和市场是浮动的

Because players and the market are fluctuating.

它做出一些调整

It makes some adjustments.

我最开始听到这个选题

When I first heard about this topic

我也有一个点

I also have a point.

就是因为我是

It is precisely because I am.

英雄联盟一个英雄

A hero from League of Legends.

叫大虫子的玩家

Players who call it a big worm.

叫科加斯

Called Kegas.

然后这个英雄

Then this hero

其实是一个上路坦克

Actually, it's a tank on the road.

它就是抗压

It is pressure-resistant.

然后提供控制

Then provide control.

团战就打控制

In team battles, focus on control.

能长大

Can grow up.

对

Yes

然后它的大招叫盛宴

Then its ultimate ability is called Feast.

这个盛宴的效果是什么

What is the effect of this feast?

就是敌方血量

It's the enemy's health points.

低到一定程度的时候

When it drops to a certain level.

然后你一口能给他啃死

Then you can bite him to death in one go.

斩杀

Slaughter

对

Yes.

然后敌方单位

Then the enemy unit.

你可以是啃小兵

You can be a small pawn.

你可以是啃英雄

You can be a hero.

然后它不会叠层数

Then it won't stack the layers.

然后但是因为那个斩杀线

But then, because of that execution line.

它没有标明

It did not specify.

所以说你要自己去判断

So you have to judge for yourself.

所以说无论是你自己打

So whether you do it yourself

你打几几

What is your score?

看几几

What do you see?

还是看比赛

Still watching the game.

如果有一套行政制操作

If there is a set of administrative procedures in place.

然后最后以一个

Then finally with a...

把人啃死为结尾

Ending with "biting someone to death."

我觉得非常有观赏性

I think it is very visually appealing.

它是按血量百分比

It is based on the percentage of blood volume.

还是说你数

Or do you want to count?

就是纯判断

It's purely a judgment.

它没有一个数字

It does not have a number.

比如说低于5%

For example, less than 5%.

大招一定能啃死

The ultimate move will definitely be able to crush it.

然后我发现有一天

Then I realized one day.

这游戏有一改动

This game has a modification.

就它加了一个斩杀线提示

It just added a kill line prompt.

就是我能看到

I can see that.

什么时候啃

When to gnaw?

就比如说血肠

For example, blood sausage.

血肠有个杠是吗

Is there a stick in the blood sausage?

对

Yes.

血肠是红的

The blood sausage is red.

然后到了一个阶段

Then it reached a stage.

发现血肠变成深红了

The blood sausage has turned deep red.

游戏在告诉你

The game is telling you.

这时候使劲

At this moment, exert strength.

这就啃死了

This is a dead end.

对

Correct.

然后这种

Then this kind

对我这种大宠老玩家

For a big pet player like me.

就特别不友好

It's just particularly unfriendly.

我说你看不起谁

Who do you think you're better than?

我靠

Damn!

这是一种婆

This is a kind of grandmother.

你发现了

You discovered.

当然

Of course.

为什么这个构成看不起你

Why does this structure look down on you?

以前是靠玩家的经验去判断

In the past, it relied on players' experience to make judgments.

判断

Judgment

然后比如说

Then, for example,

这种能力

This ability

对

Yes

你要看极紧

You need to look very closely.

他最后就是特别自信的啃一口

In the end, he confidently took a bite.

然后回头走了

Then turned around and walked away.

这真的是一种观赏性

This is truly a form of appreciation.

以前躲技能

Previously dodged skills.

就是都没有歧视的

There is no discrimination at all.

他是靠经验

He relies on experience.

他知道那个技能

He knows that skill.

大概范围是多少

What is the approximate range?

一回头啪躲开了

As soon as I turned around, I dodged.

现在他把那技能

Now he has that skill.

给你递上画上框

Here is the framed picture for you.

就这框里他打你

He'll hit you right in this frame.

一秒钟以后

One second later.

这技能落下来

This skill has fallen.

对框框也打不着

Can't hit the frame either.

我给你装一红绿灯

I'll install a traffic light for you.

闪

Flash

躲躲

Hide and seek.

对

Yes.

那种劲

That kind of strength.

对

Yes.

这是让我比较

This is what makes me compare.

不开心

Unhappy

然后还有一个

Then there's another one.

其实是我们就是从

Actually, we are just from

一局游戏开始之前

Before the start of a game.

就你选英雄之后

After you select a hero

英雄联盟他会点

League of Legends, he can play.

天赋和符文

Talents and runes

这是很久以前的

This was a long time ago.

天赋就是三个技能数

Talent refers to three skill points.

然后有30个点

Then there are 30 points.

你可以随便build

You can build freely.

这块点21

This point is 21.

这块点9

This spot is worth 0.9.

那块不点

That area is not clickable.

然后复文系统

Then the复文 system

是一个巨大的面板

It is a giant panel.

然后你可以上

Then you can go up.

在上面上

On top of it.

相大复文小复文

Xiang Da Fu Wen, Xiao Fu Wen.

对

Yes.

然后这个复文的页

Then the page of this compound text.

要花钱

It costs money.

然后里边符文也要单花钱

Then the runes inside also need to be purchased separately.

游戏内货币也可以

In-game currency is also acceptable.

然后你花钱

Then you spend money.

人民币买也可以

You can also buy with Renminbi.

它是会提升强度的吧

It will enhance the intensity, right?

会提升你游戏内强度

It will enhance your in-game strength.

那就

Then let's do it.

就比如说我

For example, me.

我玩英雄联盟

I play League of Legends.

我前就是玩上单

I used to play top lane.

就是坦克

It's a tank.

我就是抗压

I am resilient to pressure.

我就是在塔底归缩

I am just shrinking back at the base of the tower.

然后我玩一个

Then I play one.

叫大树的英雄

The hero called Big Tree.

比如说我补塔刀

For example, I am supplementing my tower knife.

我就是需要有一点攻速

I just need a little attack speed.

能让我快点补

Can you let me catch up quickly?

要不然那兵我就补不着

Otherwise, I won't be able to reinforce that soldier.

所以我会在复文页里边

So I will be on the reply page.

多加点大攻速精华

Add more attack speed essence.

这是我玩大树的

This is me playing with the big tree.

英雄的一个套路

A tactic of heroes.

但是有一年

But there was one year.

英雄联盟把这个天赋和复文

League of Legends combines this talent and the revival.

合二为一了

Merged as one.

就你不用再买复文

You don't need to buy the Wen again.

你不用再

You don't need to anymore.

你不用再什么点天赋数

You don't need to count talents anymore.

就是这一套

This is the whole set.

就四套天赋

Just four sets of talents.

你可以点

You can order.

然后你甚至可以

Then you can even

就像我这种无脑玩家

Just like a mindless player like me.

我装个Vgame

I'm pretending to be a Vgame.

还有一件

One more thing.

一件什么装备

What piece of equipment?

Uzi的天赋

Uzi's talent

其实它等于做了个减法

In fact, it equals to doing a subtraction.

对

Yes.

就是做了

Just did it.

能感同身受你的难受

I can empathize with your pain.

就是因为你

It's because of you.

对于你自己个性化的需求

For your personalized needs.

你有一个定制化的操作

You have a customized operation.

后来你不给我这机会了

Later you didn't give me this opportunity.

然后你这个事

Then about this matter of yours.

被主办方给牺牲掉了

Sacrificed by the organizer.

用来满足别人的降门槛

Used to lower the barriers for others.

让别人的方面

Let others have the way.

对 是的

Yes.

为了别人的方面

For the sake of others.

牺牲你的

Sacrifice your...

就是那种

It's that kind of.

装逼

Showing off.

也不是装逼

It's not about trying to show off, either.

就是你的一丁点的

It's just a tiny bit of you.

有一个微观的

There is a microscopic one.

小小私是吧

Is it a little private?

对 就是你额外的

Yes, it's just your extra.

你能做的

What you can do.

让自己变得更强一点点

Make yourself a little bit stronger.

对 是

Yes.

我能在对象期

I can expect from the partner.

更狗一点

More like a dog.

就你刚才说那个夫人夜

About what you just mentioned, madam night.

最早那个夫人夜

The earliest lady of the night.

和2190那东西

And that thing with 2190.

就是当年

It was back then.

导致我玩不下去

It makes it difficult for me to continue playing.

英雄联盟的核心原因

The core reason for League of Legends.

而且我买不起那夫人

And I can't afford that lady.

对 夫人夜很贵

Yes, madam, it's very expensive at night.

对 我就是偶尔

Yes, I do occasionally.

会可能跟8号放学

It might be after school on the 8th.

去跟别的同学

Go with other classmates.

去网吧玩一小会儿

Go to the internet cafe to play for a little while.

我俩都是

Both of us are.

平时不玩英雄联盟的人

People who usually don't play League of Legends.

没有那个钱去买那个夫人

I don't have the money to buy that lady.

但是因为跟朋友一起匹配

But it’s because I matched with a friend.

匹到的都是很强的人

The ones matched are all very strong people.

对 他可能是满了

Yes, he might be full.

我就缺那点护甲穿透

I just lack that little bit of armor penetration.

我对线就对不过他

I can't win against him in the lane.

但是那不是因为

But that is not because

我的技术不行

My skills are not good.

经济游戏里还有这种

There are still such things in the economic game.

对 那时候是这样的

Yes, it was like that at that time.

现在没有

Not now.

我上学的时候

When I was in school

现在就是合二为一了

Now it is time to combine the two into one.

人人平等了现在

Everyone is equal now.

天赋符合二为一之后

After the talent aligns with the duality of one.

其实就更考验

In fact, it tests even more.

这个英雄的面板素质了

The stats of this hero are really good.

你包括为了比赛观场上

You include watching the competition in the venue.

可能更提前中野的强度

It may be more intense in Nakano earlier.

然后好死不死

And then, just my luck.

我在这个时候开始玩AD了

I started playing AD at this time.

然后AD就是现在

Then AD is now.

谁见都能秒

Anyone can see it instantly.

这个事感觉

This matter feels...

就是我听你描述

It's just that I hear you describe.

感觉这个变化

Feeling this change.

导致这个游戏

Causes this game

对你来说变少了

It has become less for you.

就变少了一点点

It just becomes a little less.

就是它的可以玩的东西

It's just the things that can be played with.

就这个

Just this.

这桌面上

On this desk.

有一百个事可以这样

There are a hundred things that can be done this way.

也可以那样

It can also be like that.

现在变成99个事

Now it has become 99 things.

有一个事没了

There is one thing that is gone.

而且我是需要通过天赋和符合

Moreover, I need to go through talent and compliance.

去提升我对线能力的不足的

To improve my shortcomings in lane ability.

对

Yes.

然后还有一个

Then there is one more.

其实是22年底

Actually, it was the end of 2022.

22年吧

It should be 22 years.

他把那个小兵仇恨给

He gave that little soldier hatred.

就对线其实是这个英雄

It's actually this hero in terms of laning.

这个游戏最关键的时候

The most critical moment of this game.

就我是一个小白玩家

I'm just a novice player.

然后你是一个王者玩家

Then you are a king player.

咱俩完全对不了线

We are completely out of sync.

就你能把我压出经验区

Only you can push me out of the experience zone.

就我连小兵看都不能看

I can't even take a look at the minions.

然后他把小兵仇恨给

Then he gave the little soldier hatred.

这就导致一个后果

This leads to a consequence.

就是我如果我是一个对线能力

It's just that if I have the ability to lane.

比如说我十分满分

For example, I have a perfect score.

我是一个三分的人

I am a person of three points.

但我就是能在线上待了

But I can stay online.

就我顶多亏点兵线

I will at most lose some minions.

就拉平了

Just leveled out.

就是这个游戏对我来说

This game is everything to me.

就是不断的在做减法

It's just constantly doing subtraction.

不断的在拉平

Constantly leveling off.

他不断的在照顾那些

He constantly takes care of those.

玩的没那么好的人

People who don't play as well.

想让大家都来试试

I want everyone to give it a try.

对

Yes.

然后其实你像英雄联盟

Then actually you are like League of Legends.

核心玩家

Core player

还是我觉得我个人分享

Or I think I should share personally.

87到97这十年

The ten years from '87 to '97.

就现在已经都进入社会了

Now everyone has already entered society.

然后你版本更新又那么快

Then your version updates so quickly.

就不像篮球

It's not like basketball.

你篮球比如说

You basketball, for example.

不可能我今年把场改成圆形了

It's impossible, I changed the venue to a circular shape this year.

嗯

Uh-huh.

然后明年我又说

Then I'll say again next year.

在场内几个点按个弹簧

Press a spring at a few points in the venue.

你在场上你可以直接扣篮

You can directly dunk when you're on the court.

或者你加个四分线五分线

Or you can add a quarter line and a half line.

那不是

That's not it.

Mobile游戏实际是一个变动

Mobile games are actually a change.

很多的一个游戏

A lot of a game.

然后我其实刚才说了这么多

So I have actually said so much just now.

其实都是这个游戏非常小的点

In fact, it's all just a very small aspect of this game.

我觉得核心还是

I think the core is still...

就是当下这个游戏想做什么

It's about what this game wants to do right now.

你是想拉新

Are you looking to acquire new customers?

你是想回流

Do you want to flow back?

对

Correct.

你是想吸引情怀

You want to attract emotion.

那些大儿付费

Those big sons pay.

还是想小孩破冰付费

Still want the child to break the ice and pay.

比如说前两年

For example, the past couple of years.

还是去年英雄联盟

Still last year's League of Legends.

推出了一个3000块钱的皮肤

A skin priced at 3000 yuan has been released.

对

Correct.

然后他的

Then his

就疯了

Just crazy.

他的就是得到条件也比较苛刻

His conditions are relatively harsh.

3000就很苛刻

3000 is really strict.

在我看来

In my opinion

在我看来就是

In my opinion, it is.

你就是收割情怀玩家

You are just a player who harvests feelings.

然后你再吸引一波回流

Then you attract another wave of returning visitors.

咋的

What's going on?

花3000块钱还得干啊

Spending 3000 yuan still requires effort.

还是什么的

Or something like that.

就是花3000块钱可以直接得到

You can directly obtain it by spending 3000 yuan.

是一个十周年

It's a tenth anniversary.

就是一个faker的一个狐狸皮肤

It's just a Faker's fox skin.

那还行

That's fine.

对

Yes.

就是3000块钱

It's just 3000 yuan.

就卖的很贵嘛

It's just sold very expensively.

对

Correct.

就你都能

Just you can.

是吧

Is that so?

你能干很多很多事情

You can do a lot of things.

但是我

But I

我昨晚一思考

I thought about it last night.

我发现我在意的这些小点

I realize that I care about these little things.

你买了吗

Did you buy it?

我没买

I didn't buy it.

就我发现

I just found out.

他买了

He bought it.

我发现我在意的这些小点

I realize that I care about these little details.

其实都是游戏改文中

Actually, it's all adaptations from games.

洪流中特别

Special in the torrent

小的那个水花

The smaller splash of water.

就根本其实都

It is fundamentally all.

因为你以前是干这行

Because you used to work in this field.

你以前是英雄联盟

You used to be a League of Legends player.

这个行业内的

Within this industry.

对

Yes.

你能说说这游戏

Can you talk about this game?

它是走下坡还是怎么着

Is it on a downward slope or what?

它现在这个量

Its current quantity.

我觉得是这样

I think it is like this.

就是还是想回到

I just want to go back.

我刚才提到那个

I just mentioned that.

我开始回到那个

I started to go back to that.

那个词

That word.

就是需求的阉割

It's a castration of demand.

就是现在英雄联盟

It's League of Legends right now.

它吸引拉新

It attracts new users.

包括维稳的一个套路

Including a strategy for maintaining stability.

它不是说我

It doesn't say me.

游戏内改动

In-game changes

它游戏内改动已经改不动了

It can no longer be changed within the game.

它是说推出PVE模式

It is saying to launch the PVE mode.

比如说那个虚伪行动的模式

For example, the mode of hypocritical action.

它里边叫无尽狂潮

It's called the Endless Frenzy inside.

我希望玩家留在这个IP里面

I hope players stay within this IP.

就让玩家进行一个内部活水

Let the players engage in an internal flow of activity.

然后比如说

Then for example

我就是没有精力玩英雄联盟

I just don't have the energy to play League of Legends.

当我可以下棋

When can I play chess?

所以说英雄联盟加了自走棋

So, League of Legends has added auto chess.

让英雄联盟很赚了一波

League of Legends made a lot of profit.

包括我可能我喜欢团战

Including me, I might like team battles.

我就是有一个大乱斗模式

I just have a big brawl mode.

就是这个模式里边

It's just within this model.

就是直打团战

Just go straight for team fights.

就还是玩家的需求

It all depends on the players' needs.

其实在不断严格

In fact, it is becoming increasingly strict.

然后我发现

Then I discovered.

其实游戏

Actually, the game.

你不管怎么改动

No matter how you change it.

你永远无法平衡

You can never find balance.

新老玩家两方面的需求

The needs of both new and old players.

就是我在意的英雄联盟的改动

It's the changes in League of Legends that I care about.

是因为我是老玩家

It's because I am an experienced player.

但我可能在我新入坑的一个游戏里面

But I might be in a new game that I just started getting into.

把这个遗憾找回来了

Retrieved this regret.

对 这是我昨天晚上想

Yes, this is what I thought last night.

服务性游戏整体的这么一个大框架

The overall framework of service-oriented games.

就是市场玩家的需求是浮动的

The demand of market players is fluctuating.

还是看玩家游戏在这个阶段想干什么

It still depends on what the players want to do at this stage of the game.

所以我觉得

So I think

你像塔克夫就逃离性游戏

You escape like Tarkov in the survival game.

然后你像MOBA

Then you are like MOBA.

我觉得都是市场

I think it's all about the market.

在玩家不知道自己需求的什么的前提下

On the premise that players do not know what their needs are.

然后他告诉玩家你的需求是什么

Then he tells the player what your needs are.

所以我觉得这两个品类的游戏都很了不起

So I think both categories of games are incredible.

MOBA 吃鸡和车历性游戏

MOBA, battle royale, and driving simulation games.

对 我觉得这三个品类

Yes, I think these three categories.

在这个环境下

In this environment.

我觉得都是很了不起的

I think it's all amazing.

他说的是一个

He is talking about one.

我觉得可能还是

I think it might still be.

就是服务谁的问题

It's a question of who to serve.

他说的是一个服务型游戏

He is talking about a service-oriented game.

世界里面的一种类似于重力的存在

An existence similar to gravity within the world.

他逃不脱一种趋势

He cannot escape a certain trend.

是

Yes

听起来挺没解的

It sounds quite confusing.

是

Yes

就像我提到什么

Just like I mentioned something.

这得不用解那咋办

Then what should we do without solving it?

斩杀线

Kill line

这种其实都无所谓

It doesn't really matter.

这妥协就妥协了

This compromise is a compromise.

我觉得还是因为

I think it's still because.

现在手游玩家的声音太大了

The voice of mobile game players is too loud now.

我觉得无论是单机游戏

I think whether it's a single-player game

包括英文联盟这种网游

Including online games like English League.

我觉得不得不做出一些妥协

I feel that I have to make some compromises.

因为手游的收容太大

Because the capacity of mobile games is too large.

他们的声音太大了

Their voices are too loud.

你看斗地主他需要改吗

Do you think Dou Di Zhu needs any changes?

他完全不需要改

He doesn't need to change at all.

因为手游现在这个行业

Because the mobile gaming industry is currently like this.

就像一个巨大的灯塔一样

Like a giant lighthouse.

反而是单机买断制游戏

Instead, it is a one-time purchase game.

成了那个光

Became that light.

稍微照进去一点的那个地方

The area that slightly shines in.

我反而觉得

I instead feel that.

这个不存在说

This does not exist.

有一拨人叫手游玩家

There is a group of people called mobile game players.

因为大家都在玩

Because everyone is playing.

我也

Me too.

我手机里也有游戏

I also have games on my phone.

就不存在说

There is no saying.

有一拨人就是玩手机游戏的人

There is a group of people who are mobile game players.

然后他们在

Then they are at

如果真是那样的话

If that's really the case.

那就不会影响别人了

Then it won't affect others.

对

Yes.

而且他不是人家诚心实意

Moreover, he is not sincerely intent on it.

想玩你喜欢的东西

I want to play with the things you like.

你是啥意思

What do you mean?

你是不想让人玩

You don't want people to play.

你不也是想让人玩吗

Aren't you also wanting someone to play with?

我倒是无所谓

I don't mind at all.

人家就说

Someone said

反正人家这时候

Anyway, at this time, other people...

就人家就说了

They just said it.

说那你给我降点门槛

Then you should lower the threshold for me.

那你给不给人降呢

So will you give someone a discount or not?

玩你们这混游戏

Playing your messed-up game.

但是在法环以前

But before the Ring of Law.

我打不过

I can't win.

我到法环我就能打过了

I can win once I reach the Elden Ring.

他说这个

He said this.

所以我终于能玩

So I can finally play.

我是真想玩

I really want to play.

那咋的

So what?

你能开除我们还是怎么

Can you fire us or what?

对我觉得法环很好

I think the Elden Ring is great.

我觉得这个很好

I think this is great.

法环没有降低门槛

The law ring has not lowered the threshold.

他用一个游戏设计的

He used a game design.

对

Correct.

所以牛逼

So awesome.

他用游戏设计的方式

He used a game design approach.

咱那些常常会

Those of us who often会

但是你要是以混游戏

But if you're just messing around.

作为一个主体来说话的话

Speaking as a主体.

就是降门槛

It is to lower the threshold.

他就是

He is.

他把一个

He took a

他把一个十千万的事

He made a big deal out of something worth ten million.

降到了三千万的门槛

Dropped to a threshold of thirty million.

那门槛就是降了

The threshold has been lowered.

不管具体怎么来实现的

No matter how it is specifically achieved.

对吧

Right?

对

Yes.

咱那些常常会下面就有人说

Some people often say below that we...

因为咱那次讨论到难度的事

Because we discussed the issue of difficulty that time.

到难度的事了

It's a difficult matter now.

就有些用户说

Some users say.

那个什么

That what's it.

你要是觉得这游戏太难

If you think this game is too difficult.

你去玩服务型游戏去

You go play service-type games.

这是原话

This is the original statement.

当时他说的

What he said at the time.

这话很难听

This sounds very harsh.

而且直觉上

Moreover, intuitively

我觉得咱们

I think we should...

这个话直觉上

This statement intuitively

不思考的时候

When not thinking.

会觉得肯定不太对

It definitely feels wrong.

这么说

That said.

这么说不合适

It's inappropriate to say that.

但我要一想

But I need to think.

好像也没有什么

It seems like there's nothing much.

特别的什么的方法

A special method of some kind.

去反驳人

Go refute people.

当时我的第一反应

At that moment, my first reaction.

是什么法环

What is the Law Ring?

不是服务型游戏

Not a service-oriented game.

这就是今天

This is today.

我刚才

I just now.

一开始想提的那个事

The thing I wanted to mention at the beginning.

对来说已经很服务了

It's already very accommodating.

就是服务这个事

It's just about the service.

不是固定的

Not fixed.

就是说

That is to say.

手游是服务型游戏

Mobile games are service-oriented games.

银色联盟是服务型游戏

The Silver Alliance is a service-oriented game.

单机游戏

Single-player game

我觉得是比较级

I think it's a comparative degree.

法环跟黑魂一比

Compared to Dark Souls, Elden Ring.

那就是服务型游戏

That is a service-oriented game.

太服务了

Too service-oriented.

但是法环跟黑神

But the Ring of Law and the Dark God.

别别别

No no no.

就是跟

Just with.

跟一些更

With some more

战神

God of War

跟别的游戏比

Compared to other games.

它绝对不算服务型游戏

It definitely cannot be considered a service-type game.

它挺硬核的

It's pretty hardcore.

太不服务了

So unservice-oriented.

这是比较级的事

This is a matter of comparison.

我觉得

I think.

但是我们只把话题

But we only focus on the topic

放在魂系列内

Placed within the Soul series.

因为我认为

Because I think

那个用户

That user.

回复这事的那用户

The user who replied to this matter.

他肯定指的也是

He must be referring to that as well.

你要是玩不惯法环

If you can't get used to playing the Ring of Faith.

你去玩点更服务型游戏

You should play some more service-oriented games.

但是我就会觉得

But I would feel that way.

我们今天

We today

今天我们这节目聊的

Today we are discussing this program.

就是魂的事

It's a matter of the soul.

你去玩法环了

You went to play in the circle.

你已经是在玩

You are already playing.

最服务型的

The most service-oriented.

所以说我就是在

So I am just in...

游戏联盟中

In the game league.

婆那一部分

That part of the grandmother.

其实在法环中找回来

Actually, it's about finding it back in the Ring of Law.

其实你的想法

Actually, your idea.

有某种程度上

To a certain extent.

可以概括为

Can be summarized as

某种婆

Certain mother-in-law.

是吗

Is that so?

就是老的

It's just old.

我说他刚才

I said he just now.

对那个

About that.

就是他有一些

It's just that he has some.

坚持的一些

Some things to persist in.

在游戏里玩

Play in the game.

为的咱们的那个东西

For our thing.

但是呢

But you see

他可能有一点门槛

He might have a bit of a barrier.

或者什么的

Or something like that.

跟黑魂

With Dark Souls

一样

The same

就是特别硬核的那些

It's just those that are particularly hardcore.

连传送点都不给全了

Not even providing all the teleportation points.

你要自己把整个游戏地图

You need to create the entire game map yourself.

都记上来

Remember it all.

什么的

What kind of?

然后对于

Then for

对一个事

Regarding one matter.

可能没那么要求的人来说

For those who may not have such strict requirements.

你这个事

This matter of yours.

其实是个障碍

Actually, it's a barrier.

然后呢

And then?

游戏为了扩充自己的

The game aims to expand its own.

这个市场

This market.

就把这个慢慢消解

Just let this slowly dissolve.

那作为以前

That as it was before.

在咱们这个东西的

In our thing.

那个人

That person.

就会觉得

Just feel that

你在剥夺我的乐趣

You are depriving me of my enjoyment.

就是中心老师说的

It's exactly what the center teacher said.

我本来有一百个事

I originally had a hundred things.

对

Yes.

拿走了一些

Took away some.

我能玩的东西

Things I can play with.

魂1那个

Soul 1 that one.

在能传送之前

Before it can be transmitted.

你觉得那游戏变少了

You think that game has decreased.

对

Correct.

就是少了

It’s just lacking.

缩缩了一点

Shrunk a little.

对

Correct.

只要我不能传送

As long as I can't transfer.

那我规划路线

Then I'll plan the route.

这件事是很有意思的

This matter is very interesting.

先去哪后去哪

First go here, then go there.

节省时间

Save time.

甚至有

Even has

普罗门玩家进boss战

Pro player enters the boss battle.

然后发现

Then realized.

就是稀里糊涂一打

Just a muddled hit.

那boss马上就要死了

That boss is about to die.

然后自己

Then oneself.

情急之下把游戏关了

In a moment of urgency, I closed the game.

不行不行

No way, no way.

打完了就没了

Once it's finished, it's gone.

对对对

Yes, yes, yes.

不行

No way.

我就把装备脱了

I just took off the equipment.

重新打

Restart the game.

就是醉婆那种

It's that kind of drunk woman.

我刚才为什么提手

Why did I raise my hand just now?

我是因为

I am because.

2021年

Year 2021

我接触到了英雄联盟手游

I came into contact with League of Legends Mobile.

就这个英雄联盟手游

Just this League of Legends mobile game.

就像刚才仲勤老师说

Just like what Teacher Zhongqin said earlier.

就是英雄联盟这游戏

It's the game League of Legends.

在我的手机底下变小了

It got smaller under my phone.

不仅是画面变小了

Not only has the picture become smaller.

它地图也变小了

Its map has also shrunk.

可玩的东西就是

The playable things are

然后兵线变短了

Then the minion wave became shorter.

节奏特别特别快了

The rhythm has become extremely, extremely fast.

是

Yes

然后我刚接触英雄联盟手游

Then I just started getting into League of Legends Mobile.

那一个月就是

That month was

在里边就无底

Inside is bottomless.

就是乱杀

It's just indiscriminate killing.

就是因为它走A

It’s just because it goes A.

就是英雄联盟里边

It's just in League of Legends.

有一句叫走A

There is a saying called "Walk A."

就是你要点一地板

You just need to point to the floor.

然后再A一下目标单位

Then check the target unit again.

这其实是一个

This is actually a

特别考验节奏的东西

Something that particularly tests rhythm.

是

Yes

但它在手机里

But it's in the phone.

就是特别无脑

It is particularly brainless.

就你只要拖动你的虚拟腰杆

Just drag your virtual waist.

然后再狂按攻击键就可以了

Then just keep smashing the attack button.

哦 知道

Oh, I see.

对 然后其实就是

Yes, and then actually it's just...

英雄联盟手游

League of Legends Mobile

对我来说就是

For me, it's just that.

把这游戏变得简单了

Made this game simpler.

然后我当时玩了半年

Then I played for half a year at that time.

我再回去玩端游的时候

When I go back to playing PC games.

就已经完全玩不了端游了

I can no longer play the client game at all.

就我的需求被阉割了

My needs have been castrated.

就我只能玩

I can only play.

那你是这个意思

So you mean this?

对

Correct.

你这个形容

Your description.

我们没太get一开始

We didn't quite get it at the beginning.

是游戏阉割玩家了

The game has castrated the players.

还是玩家阉割自己的

It's still the players who are castrating themselves.

还是玩家阉割游戏了

The players have still castrated the game.

我觉得都有

I think there are both.

就那个时期

Just that period.

首先是我没有电脑

First of all, I don't have a computer.

你说题外话

You are speaking off-topic.

听你说这个事

I heard you talking about this matter.

我一直就觉得

I've always felt that.

其实我也玩到他

Actually, I also played with him.

或者什么

Or what?

英雄联盟

League of Legends

其实我是最早在内测的时候

Actually, I was one of the earliest during the beta testing phase.

我就开始有玩的那些

I just started to have those fun things.

我是觉得就是电子竞技

I think it's just esports.

这个是在竞技层面上

This is on a competitive level.

我一直觉得就是

I've always felt that way.

作为一个

As a

真的要竞技

Really need to compete.

你要说奥运会什么的

You want to talk about the Olympics or something like that.

我对这个事也持怀疑态度

I am also skeptical about this matter.

因为它受商业影响太严重

Because it is too heavily influenced by commercial interests.

是

Yes.

就像你刚才说的

Just like you said a moment ago.

我现在要招吸

I am going to recruit now.

这个游戏的规则

The rules of this game.

能倾向到

Can lean towards

就倾斜到某种

Just tilted to a certain degree.

我觉得以竞技的标准来说

I think in terms of competitive standards

太过分的程度

Excessive degree.

而且它是完全人定的

And it is entirely man-made.

完全人写的代码来

Code written by a complete person.

你比如说NBA

For example, the NBA.

就是我不太懂

I just don't understand very well.

但是我知道

But I know.

比如说他不允许联防

For example, he doesn't allow zone defense.

跟国际的来联比

Compare with the international standards.

他是为啥呢

Why is he like that?

为了好看

For the sake of appearances.

这也算是受商业影响

This can also be considered as being influenced by business.

但也就紧到此为止了

But that's as far as it goes.

就是我不

It's just that I don't.

你不可能说NBA

You can't say NBA.

为了好看

For the sake of looking good.

晚篮夸张低点

Evening basketball exaggerated low point.

就是

Just is.

咱三打三

Let's have a three-on-three match.

以后不打

I won't hit (you) anymore.

五打五了

It's five against five.

为了进球更多一点

In order to score a bit more goals.

就他不会到这个程度

He wouldn't go that far.

但是电子竞技的东西会

But esports will...

真的

Really.

对

Correct.

我觉得电子竞技问题

I think there is a problem with esports.

就是它版本更新太密

It's just that the version updates are too frequent.

谁说就算

Who says it's just fine?

因为我们有一个

Because we have one.

全球的联盟

Global Alliance

说咱们规定说

Let's say we specify.

不允许他们

Do not allow them.

那个拳头下他们修

They repair under that fist.

没有人限制他

No one is restricting him.

完全没有

Absolutely none.

就比如说这个版本

Take this version as an example.

我是一个混子

I am a slacker.

然后我能混住

Then I can stay for free.

因为它是中路版本

Because it is the central road version.

然后下一个版本改完之后

Then after the next version is finished.

我就混不住了

I just can't stand it anymore.

它有一个这样

It has one like this.

但你看篮球

But you watch basketball.

那规则

That rule.

你几十年

You decades.

对

Correct.

我们都没变过

We have all not changed.

它受商业影响太严重

It is too heavily influenced by商业.

对

Yes.

拳头如果今天活不下去了

If the fist cannot survive today.

它啥事都干得出来

It can do anything.

反正就这种事

In any case, it's that kind of thing.

你要是

If you want to

如果你把所有这种事

If you put all these things...

全部诠释为一种

Interpreted as a whole.

就是妥协

It is compromise.

软化和庸俗什么的

Soften and vulgarity, and so on.

我觉得你真是

I think you are truly...

没有进入过社会

Has not entered society.

那不是

That's not it.

社会就是这样的

That's how society is.

是吧

Is that so?

不是

No.

你一个游戏

You a game.

就是说你这个品类

That means your category.

这个品类原来天花板

This category originally had a ceiling.

是100万套

It is one million sets.

就一个小品类

Just a small category.

你现在

You now.

因为你卖100万套

Because you sold 1 million sets.

你扣完渠道以后

After you deduct the channel fees.

你落你手里

You fall into your hands.

就是

That is.

那个1000多万

That 10 million or so.

美元的

US dollar

你再做下一个

You do the next one.

然后你做到

Then you did it.

这个品类比天下第一

This category is better than the best in the world.

你还能卖100万套

You can still sell 1 million units.

因为你这破玩意的

Because of this broken thing of yours.

那个天花板就100万套

That ceiling is 1 million sets.

那你这个品类的游戏

Then, the games in your category.

永远就不可能花

It can never bloom forever.

超过1000万美元做

Over 10 million dollars.

因为超了你就赔了

Because you exceeded it, you will incur a loss.

对不对

Is that right?

对

Correct.

好

Good

现在你想花5000万美元

Now you want to spend 50 million dollars.

做这品类

Engaging in this category.

因为你喜欢这个品类

Because you like this category.

你想把这品类

You want to categorize this.

做更好

Do better.

你从地方里抠

You dig from the place.

你得给我多出来

You have to give me more.

400万的人来玩

4 million people come to play.

你得做到500万品类

You have to achieve 5 million categories.

你才敢花得出去

You can only dare to spend.

5000万的成本

50 million in costs

是不是

Is it?

是

Yes.

那是的话

If that's the case.

那你从哪抠呢

Then where are you picking it from?

你告诉我

You tell me.

哪块卡人

Which card is stuck?

就是对呀

That's right.

那你能不抠吗

Then can you not pick?

那你非要坚持

Then you must insist.

你这品类

Your category.

你这撤离

Your evacuation.

然后里边有12种

Then there are 12 types inside.

不一样的子弹

Different bullets

然后非让人背这个东西

Then they forced someone to carry this thing.

每次还是哪一项

Which one is it each time?

不是

No.

就是浑身都是你的原则

It’s just that my whole body is filled with your principles.

和节操

And integrity.

浑身都是这个游戏

My whole body is this game.

最核心的乐趣

The core enjoyment.

这个游戏菜单看不清楚字

The text on this game menu is hard to read.

也是这个游戏

It's also this game.

最核心的乐趣

The core joy.

那我觉得你这疯了

Then I think you're crazy.

简直是

Simply is.

但是有一个客观事实

But there is an objective fact.

就是有一些游戏的

It's just some games.

所谓咱们说

What we call is

用老玩家来形容

Describing it with veteran players.

他的一些

Some of his

就是固有的

It is inherent.

多年的拥顿来说

For years of congestion.

他对这个事是反对的

He is opposed to this matter.

我不喜欢那么多人来玩

I don't like so many people coming to play.

是

Yes

会有这种人

There will be such people.

因为我们玩

Because we play.

太了不起了

So amazing!

这品类就属于你

This category belongs to you.

对呀

That's right.

我们玩挺好

We are having a great time playing.

你是这个品类的家长

You are the parent of this category.

对

Correct.

就是有这种人

There are indeed such people.

或者说有一种声音

Or there is a kind of voice.

或者可能

Or it may be.

你真实想法是

What are your true thoughts?

我能不能不让游戏

Can I not let the game?

往下降去够你们

Go down to reach you.

是你们往上涨涨

It's you who keep rising.

来够我们

Come to us.

那这绝对不可能

Then this is absolutely impossible.

对

Correct.

你去当人民教师呗

You should become a teacher for the people.

你去教大家打游戏呗

You go teach everyone how to play games.

我不知道

I don't know.

谁能够在自己生活中的

Who can in their own life

每一件事上

In every matter.

都是婆罗门

They are all Brahmins.

就是不可能

It is just impossible.

都叫进去吗

Is everyone called in?

就是

Just is

你再试

Try again.

你玩那个

You play that.

玩某版贼婆

Play a certain version of Thief Grandma.

玩你玩这动作游戏贼婆

Playing this action game is really annoying.

玩你玩塔克福尼贼婆

Play with you, play with Takfu, you thief!

就是你玩射击

It's just that you play shooting games.

你也贼婆

You are also a thief.

你说这个事

You said this matter.

你就玩任何东西

You can play with anything.

你都玩的

You've played everything.

犯存在的双标

Commit the double standard of existence.

真的

Really.

你说这个特别

You said this is special.

就是不顺着你的

Just not going along with you.

你就开始说

You can start speaking.

这个人就是装

This person is just pretending.

就是那个婆罗门

It's that Brahmin.

完了

Finished.

我把录个节目成双标了

I turned recording a show into double standards.

不是我就说

It's not me, I'm just saying.

人都双标

People have double standards.

确实

Indeed.

双标是常见的

Double standards are common.

对我来说

For me

我就希望FPS游戏

I just hope for FPS games.

能给我加点门槛

Can you raise the threshold for me?

对

Yes.

但我觉得黑魂出简单难度

But I think Dark Souls should have an easy mode.

臭傻逼

Stupid idiot.

对吧

Right?

忍龙出寺是吧

The Dragon of Patience is leaving the temple, right?

忍龙别出寺

The Dragon of Patience Leaves the Temple.

这没办法

There's no way to do this.

忍龙的拥吞

The Devouring of the Enduring Dragon

就是这个事的

It's about this matter.

特别集中的一个体现

A manifestation of particular concentration.

当然我确实

Of course, I indeed do.

因为你玩过任何一个品类

Because you've played any category.

玩的深一点的玩家

Players who are more deeply engaged.

都能够很诚恳的跟别人说

Can sincerely talk to others.

完全不是装

Absolutely not pretending.

就是我真告诉你

I really tell you.

就是你可能不知道

It's just that you might not know.

这个品类里有一些

There are some in this category.

不足以外人道也的

Not enough to be spoken of by outsiders.

就是那个

It's that one.

就是它有一些特殊

It has some special features.

就是它不那么让你舒服

It just doesn't make you feel that comfortable.

是有原因的

There is a reason for it.

它有些事

It has some matters.

因为它是一整体

Because it is a whole.

它必须得那样

It has to be that way.

会这么说

Will say this.

但这个事

But this matter

不能包含这个游戏的一切东西

Cannot include everything about this game.

所以我觉得

So I feel that

这个统一的逻辑

This unified logic.

可以包含这个游戏里面

Can be included in this game.

百分之七八十的东西

Seventy to eighty percent of things.

对

Correct.

但并不是意味着

But it doesn't mean that.

你让我刷一个偶

You want me to swipe an idol.

都不能给保底

None can guarantee a minimum.

因为它不是每一个设计的决定

Because it is not a design decision for every instance.

都是跟你的核心

It's all about your core.

要表达的东西

Something to express.

是有紧密的逻辑联系

There is a close logical connection.

我觉得

I think.

刚才罗布说那事

Rob just talked about that thing.

就是有人质疑说

Some people are questioning that.

如果你觉得这难

If you find this difficult.

你去玩服务游戏那个事

The thing about you going to play service games.

然后直觉上

Then intuitively

我们觉得这个说法

We think this statement.

有点过分是吧

Isn't that a bit too much?

但你看之前

But look before.

我组织录过一期

I organized a recording session once.

那个跟二次元游戏有关

That is related to two-dimensional games.

年度节目

Annual program

向几位二次元朋友提一些问题

Ask a few questions to some friends from the two-dimensional world.

我说你们这游戏

I said your game.

以前是线上的那种游戏

It used to be the kind of game that was online.

说你耍特别特别干

I said you play particularly dry.

这个我就理解

I understand this.

它跟盈利有关系

It is related to profit.

你说毕端幻想

You said Biduan's fantasy.

这玩意你都已经单机了

You've already played this thing offline.

而且做的是个动作游戏

Moreover, it's an action game.

还做的好

Still doing well.

你干嘛把天赋术

Why did you use the talent skill?

做的什么十米多长

What is more than ten meters long?

完了

It's over.

纯纯的让我硬干时间

Simply let me do it hard for a while.

然后人说我这游戏就这样

Then the person said my game is just like this.

等等

Wait a moment.

好多底下评论说

Many comments below say

说这个就是有一种

Saying this is a kind of.

除了服务型以外

Except for service-oriented.

还有一种游戏的特性

There is another characteristic of the game.

叫陪伴型的

It's called a companion type.

我觉得这是高情商说法

I think this is a statement made with high emotional intelligence.

我这游戏就是

This game of mine is...

让你有一个事干

To give you something to do.

这种

This kind of

人家说说罗马

People talk about Rome.

你就是你没有

You are you, and you have nothing.

你不干的这种乐趣的游戏

The kind of fun game you don't play.

你就别来掺和

Don’t get involved.

你就玩你的

You just do your own thing.

因为它有一种

Because it has a kind of

我换一个措辞说

I'll rephrase it.

就是玩长线的服务型游戏

It's a service-oriented game that you play in the long run.

有一种自我绑架的感觉

There is a feeling of self-kidnapping.

就是不仅是那游戏在绑架你

It's not just that the game is holding you hostage.

是你绑架你自己

It is you who kidnapped yourself.

就是所谓的陪伴感

It is what is called a sense of companionship.

对就是因为你玩了三年了

Yes, it's because you've been playing for three years.

然后你已经花了

Then you have already spent.

几千个小时

Several thousand hours

在里边了

It's inside.

你那个账户里边

In your account.

罗列的那堆小姑娘

The group of little girls listed.

和他们的那个

And their that.

他不能简单

He cannot be simple.

被认知为沉默沉默

Recognized as silence silence.

他们的素质

Their quality.

他不是认知的问题

It's not a problem of cognition.

人过不好自己的一生

People cannot live their own life well.

不是因为他认知不行

It's not because his understanding is lacking.

道理你都懂

You understand the reasoning.

你咋还把这个

Why did you still bring this?

给过成这样呢

How did it end up like this?

这还说吗

Is there a need to say this?

这不就是你的整个

Isn't this your whole thing?

人就这样

That's just how people are.

对呀

That's right.

因为你就是感觉到

Because you just feel it.

因为我都已经投入了

Because I have already invested myself in it.

这么多东西

So many things.

所以这个账户

So this account.

我不能放下

I can't let go.

游戏你玩的时候

When you play the game.

你会觉得

You will feel.

这怎么毫无意义的在这干

What is the point of doing this here?

但是你干完了以后

But after you finish it.

这东西因为你干了

This thing happened because of you.

就很多人惯性的

It's just that many people are habitual.

玩20年

Play for 20 years.

某种世界也是这样是吧

Isn't there some kind of world like this too?

某种世界不是这样

A certain world is not like this.

就不是惯性的

It's just not inertia.

玩某一个网络游戏

Playing a specific online game.

玩十几二十年

Play for over a decade or two.

反正我不是这样

Anyway, I'm not like that.

很多人是

Many people are

我说有些人也这样

I said some people are like this too.

上点岁数了

Getting a bit older.

他已经不想说

He no longer wants to speak.

是不是沉默成本

Isn't it the cost of silence?

是不是谁办

Is it done by someone?

他没有

He doesn't have it.

已经不去想这个事

I no longer think about this matter.

就是我就得玩他了已经

I just have to play with him now.

因为我毕竟还是干了

Because I still got it done after all.

我干了这事就是真的了

What I did is the truth.

别人没干

Others haven't done it.

我比他强

I am stronger than him.

我必须得比他强

I must be stronger than him.

你不能让他跟我一样

You can't make him like me.

一个版本改

A version change.

不行

No way.

或者怎么样

Or how about that?

反正就是

Anyway, it just is.

因为我投入了时间

Because I invested time.

虽然这一边投入

Although this side is invested

我一边在觉得

I am feeling while...

这个事真无聊

This matter is really boring.

但是我也没有想着说去

But I also didn't think about going.

因为我意识到

Because I realize that

就是这种所谓的服务型游戏

It's this so-called service-oriented game.

它倒就是有一个什么特性

It does have a certain characteristic.

就是它除了需要你的时间以外

It just needs your time aside from that.

它不给你设任何的困难了

It no longer imposes any difficulties on you.

就像你比如说你说原神

Just like when you say Genshin Impact.

如果你说你敢让原神的玩家

If you say you dare to let Genshin Impact players

真玩点什么的话

If you're really going to play something.

会有很大的负面的反响

There will be a significant negative backlash.

对

Yes.

就是你看动作游戏

It's just you see action games.

不是那个崛起灵出来吗

Isn't that the emergence of the spirit?

崛起灵出来

Rise, spirit!

我玩了两天就放下了

I put it down after playing for two days.

你看原来吧

You see, originally...

就是主机玩家

It's just console players.

会有一个普遍说法

There will be a general saying.

说这个做手游的人

People who make mobile games say this.

他们不会做

They won't do it.

动作游戏他们不懂

They don't understand action games.

他们不会做

They won't do it.

不是吧

No way.

其实你感觉不是

Actually, you don't feel that way.

他就是特别不是

He is just particularly unqualified.

他会做

He can do it.

但是他就得做成这样

But he has to do it this way.

你打的时候

When you hit.

你会觉得

You will feel.

这个什么闪避架招

What is this dodging stance move?

然后那个连邪技什么的

Then that includes things like evil techniques.

他都没

He doesn't have any.

关键是那系统深度足够深

The key is that the system is deep enough.

你怎么配装

How do you equip your gear?

你怎么玩

How do you play?

你不能说这游戏本身

You can't say the game itself.

就是一不识数

It simply means not knowing numbers.

并不是这样

It’s not like that.

肯定不是

Definitely not.

但是呢

But then

他会有那种感觉

He will have that kind of feeling.

就是说

That is to say.

又抽又长的关卡

A long and winding level.

然后他需要你打

Then he needs you to hit.

特别特别长时间

A very, very long time.

因为你数值

Because of your value

还不给你快进和跳过

Still won't let you fast forward or skip.

因为你数值没上来

Because your value hasn't improved.

所以你打特别慢

So you type especially slowly.

就是说

That is to say.

那个他打你也刮

He hit you and also scratched you.

你打他也刮

You hit him and also scratch.

互相刮

Mutual scratching.

刮到你睡着

Scratched until you fall asleep.

那就是

That is

iPad都砸脸上了

The iPad hit me in the face.

就知道因为他就是

I knew it was because of him.

他这个A和RPG

His A and RPG.

的这个配重里面

in this counterweight

那个RPG永远要占到

That RPG will always take up space.

90%以上

More than 90%.

你A比我A厉害

You A is better than me A.

也不行

That's not possible either.

就不能让

Just can't let.

A厉害的人

A powerful person.

比A菜的人

People who are worse than A.

对

Yes.

明显有一个差距

There is clearly a gap.

只能让那个RPG厉害

Can only make that RPG powerful.

和RPG特别菜的人

Someone who is particularly bad at RPGs.

有差距

There is a gap.

是市场验证过的

It has been verified by the market.

是A和RPG

It is A and RPG.

在这个市场上

In this market.

大家喜好比重

Everyone's preference weight.

就是喜欢A的人

It's just that people who like A.

其实也就是一

Actually, it's just one.

对

Correct.

是吧

Is that so?

ARPG里边

in ARPG

9的人就是

A person who is 9 is.

还是喜欢RPG的

Still prefer RPGs.

对都快看不见了

It's almost invisible now.

就是这感觉

It's exactly this feeling.

所以玩ACT老害多

So there are many old-timers who play ACT.

说实话

To be honest.

而且出于恶臭

And it is due to the stench.

一聊到忍龙

As soon as we talk about Ninja Dragon

这就上来了

This just came up.

对

Correct.

就是永远是

It is always.

那天我跟谁聊天

Who was I chatting with that day?

我就说这帮人啥呢

I was just saying, what are these people doing?

鬼气第一

The first in ghostly aura.

魔女第二

Witch No. 2

先有忍龙后有天

First there is the忍龙 (Endurance Dragon), then there is the天 (Heaven).

是吧

Is that so?

就这套

Just this set.

就那点游戏

Just that little game.

就那几个游戏

Just those few games.

对

Yes.

你也说不出别的

You can't say anything else either.

ACT还有啥

What else is there for the ACT?

你就是2024年了

You are already in 2024.

鬼气五

Ghostly Energy Five

魔女三

Witch 3

还有啥

What else?

对吧

Right?

你硬核战的人来说

For those of you who are hardcore fighters.

战神都看不上

Even the God of War looks down on it.

那都是

That is all.

那对吧

That's right.

太A了

So A!

不是太RPG了

Not too RPG.

重现

Reproduce

我根本没系统

I don't have a system at all.

对

Yes.

动作性还不是双万威戏四呢

The action is still not as good as the double Wan Wei drama.

说回来说

Speaking of which

就是那个

That's the one.

我就说

I just said.

就这种游戏

Just this kind of game.

它是唯一

It is unique.

最大的困难

The biggest difficulty.

和唯一的对你的挑战

And the only challenge to you.

challenge

挑战

就是你要花很多的时间

You just need to spend a lot of time.

对

Yes.

然后用时间绑架你自己

Then kidnap yourself with time.

所以这就是我理解的

So this is what I understand.

陪伴

Accompanying

就是陪伴感的游戏里的特点

It is a characteristic of games that provide a sense of companionship.

就是它除了

It's just that it, besides...

你要花时间以外

You need to take time outside.

它不难为你任何事的

It is not difficult for it to do anything for you.

然后有些人就会说

Then some people will say

如果你不喜欢这样游戏

If you don't like playing this way.

你就不要来掺和

You don't need to meddle in this.

但是我从小

But I have been since I was little.

可能我们这一代的游戏

Perhaps the games of our generation.

游戏里就一定要

It must be in the game.

有一些挑战我的事

There are some challenges that I face.

对

Yes.

这就是你不够虚无的地方

This is where you are not nihilistic enough.

你总问

You always ask.

为什么你不能加入二次元

Why can't you join the two-dimensional world?

你看的翻比谁都多

You watch more translations than anyone else.

比谁才不合

It's not appropriate to compare with anyone.

就我玩游戏

Just me playing games.

我根本就不需要

I don't need it at all.

就是需要一个打发时间

Just need something to pass the time.

就我没有这个需求

I don't have that need.

我一直在说这个事

I've been talking about this matter.

就是我

That's me.

如果我打开游戏

If I open the game.

它不挑战我

It does not challenge me.

对

Yes.

这件事是完全

This matter is completely.

那我玩你干啥

Then what am I supposed to do with you?

完全让你导致

Completely let you lead.

你融不进去二次元的原因

The reason you can't immerse yourself in the二次元 (two-dimensional world).

对

Correct.

我根本不知道在干嘛

I have no idea what I'm doing.

你太存在主义了

You are too existentialist.

所以我以前会

So I used to.

我说我话这么难听

I said my words are so harsh.

我说这种游戏

I said this kind of game.

最后来说

In conclusion.

有一种虚假的游戏的感觉

There is a feeling of a false game.

就是我们玩游戏

It's just that we are playing a game.

以前是有一个东西

There used to be something.

就是你要给我设置一个挑战

You need to set a challenge for me.

然后给我一个系统

Then give me a system.

让我在这个系统里

Let me be in this system.

完成你的挑战

Complete your challenge.

包括咱们之前录那个pro节目

Including the pro show we recorded before.

很多老师讲过

Many teachers have talked about it.

这游戏最本质的这个事

The essence of this game.

我就想说

I just want to say

我又拐到了游戏本质论那一块了

I have turned to the essence of games segment again.

就什么事都抛开影像

Just throw everything aside and focus on the image.

抛开U15

Forget about U15.

抛开什么音乐什么的

Forget about music and such things.

就看那里边那个

Just look at the one inside there.

电子游戏有个最本质的东西

Video games have a most essential element.

这个你要做不好

You won't be able to do this well.

你这游戏就好不了

Your game won't get any better.

你们以前聊过

You have talked before.

原则聊过的事

Principles discussed matters.

但是其实我现在是反对这个事

But actually, I am opposed to this matter now.

没错

That's right.

就是你把人家服务型游戏

It's just that you have turned it into a service-oriented game.

从游戏里开除了

Expelled from the game.

你也没有捍卫到什么东西

You haven't defended anything either.

对

Yes.

也没有什么意义

It doesn't have any meaning either.

如果你往那个方向走的话

If you walk in that direction.

这个实际上

This actually

就不应该发明出电子游戏

Video games should never have been invented.

最厉害的就是围棋和接剑

The most impressive are Go and fencing.

对

Correct.

体操

Gymnastics

你练去吧

Go practice.

那个是挑战人类极限

That is challenging the limits of humanity.

你看

Look.

然后智力直线

Then the intelligence is linear.

你就跟下围棋就行了

Just play Go, that's all you need to do.

你不需要发明新的游戏了

You don't need to invent new games anymore.

有围棋你不玩

Why don't you play Go?

你非玩法环

You can't play the ring.

你已经是庸俗了

You are already vulgar.

对

Yes.

然后你说原神

Then you say Genshin Impact.

电子游戏的诞生

The birth of video games.

就是什么

It's just what.

声光电

Sound, light, and electricity

就是因为以前的桌游和什么的

It's precisely because of the board games and whatnot from before.

不够

Not enough.

对吧

Right?

然后人发明电子游戏

Then people invented video games.

就是因为这玩意有声光电

It's just because this thing has sound, light, and electricity.

你现在说这都没意义

What you are saying now is meaningless.

你给我搞游戏本质论

You are discussing the essence of games with me.

我现在是反对这个事

I am now opposed to this matter.

对

Yes.

所以我现在

So now I am

虽然依然不能和

Although it still cannot compare with

抽

Draw.

二次元小姑娘这个事共情

Empathizing with the two-dimensional girl.

但是我

But I

可以共存

Can coexist.

我特别对

I am particularly about.

特别接受这个事

Especially accept this matter.

因为你仔细想

Because you think carefully.

比如说你玩忍龙

For example, you play Ninja Gaiden.

最高级的动作戏

The highest-level action scene.

牛逼了吧

Pretty amazing, right?

你那个里边玩动作戏的时候

When you were playing action scenes inside there.

你那个爽快感

That feeling of爽快.

是不是也是生物性的

Is it also biological?

你要承认你的敌人是协调的

You have to admit that your enemy is coordinated.

你反倒有时候不是特别协调

You sometimes seem a bit uncoordinated instead.

对

Correct.

就是你看

It's just that you see.

对敌人特别协调

Especially coordinated against the enemy.

我不协调

I am not coordinated.

因为人家要的

Because that's what they want.

就是他有一种

It's just that he has a kind of.

那个缓慢的

That slow one.

怎么就敌人了

How did it become an enemy?

立场已经这么明显

The position is already so clear.

我就替你把

I'll do it for you.

我的对面是协调的

My opposite is coordinated.

对

Yes.

就是人家说了

That's what someone said.

我玩着玩着

I was playing along.

有一种缓慢的

There is a kind of slowness.

那个progression

That progression.

对吧

Right?

人家自洽

People self-consistent.

我每天我有体力

I have energy every day.

你们那个买断制的游戏里

In your game's buyout system.

都没有体力这概念

There is no concept of physical strength at all.

但我有体力

But I have energy.

我每天我得把我那体力花完

I have to expend my energy every day.

花完了

Spent all of it.

我就是最优的

I am the best.

我的那个数值

My value.

又那个就是incrementally

That's incrementally.

增长一点点

Grow a little bit.

我日积月累

I accumulate day by day and year by year.

就好像跟攒钱一样

It's just like saving money.

我攒出来了一个号

I saved up to create an account.

就还挺不错

It's quite good.

他会有一个这个

He will have one of these.

然后这个给他带来的情绪价值

Then the emotional value this brings to him.

就是特别安心

It just feels especially reassuring.

他会觉得

He will feel.

我做了一个事

I did something.

我今天没有浪费时间

I did not waste time today.

其实就没有比这更浪费时间

In fact, there is nothing more wasteful of time than this.

但是就是

But it is just...

在浪费时间的这个事上

On the matter of wasting time.

我非常有效率

I am very efficient.

这个话听着很哲学感觉

This sounds very philosophical.

对

Correct.

对吧

Right?

所以就虚无吗

So is it just emptiness?

因为我就是要这个

Because this is exactly what I want.

所以我是协调的

So I am the coordinator.

你反倒是你

You are the one instead.

在那块

On that piece.

一整就是被冒犯了

It was downright offensive.

然后觉得

Then I feel.

这怎么还说我们

How can this still be said about us?

黑神话没有保底呢

There is no guaranteed minimum for Black Myth.

哎呦

Oh boy.

就好像突然间

It’s as if suddenly.

不行

No way.

这个不能说我们不好

This can't be said that we are not good.

但是好像没有什么

But it seems like there is nothing.

好的角度辩护

Good angle for defense.

就好像你们那个东西

It's like that thing of yours.

是特神圣的

It is very sacred.

怎么着啥

What's going on?

不能碰了

Cannot touch it anymore.

谁也不能说我任何事

No one can say anything to me.

我告诉你

I'll tell you.

你慢我

You slow me down.

我今天就代表这个

I represent this today.

我

I

就这种感觉

That's the feeling.

所以我已经自省了

So I have already reflected on myself.

所以我觉得

So I think.

就是这个服务型游戏的新习俗

This is the new custom of service-oriented games.

和这个旧的

and this old one

这个买断制的

This is a buyout system.

这个开发者的自我表达

The self-expression of this developer.

和那个游戏传统设计的逻辑

And the logic of traditional design in that game.

的这个争夺

the struggle for this

还是要看你两边的

It still depends on both sides.

那个这每一个元素

Then, each of these elements

和彼此之间

And between each other

有没有广泛的联系

Are there extensive connections?

让它变成一个比较紧凑的

Make it more compact.

一个比较硬的一东西

A relatively hard thing.

就让人觉得说

It makes people feel like saying

你这东西不是拼凑的

What you have is not pieced together.

你比如说

For example, you can say...

那个玉币的游戏里面

In that jade coin game

他就为了赶时髦

He is just trying to keep up with the trend.

在测试鸟里边

In the test bird.

加没任务

No additional tasks.

他也让你做四个随机刷的

He also wants you to do four random brushes.

这个是咱俩是有共识的

This is something we both agree on.

我们都认为这个特别缺

We all think this is particularly lacking.

现在我不是说别的

I'm not saying anything else right now.

就是说你这个没有任何逻辑

It means that you have no logic at all.

就是感觉像是一个白痴想的

It just feels like something an idiot thought of.

就是说

That is to say

听说社会上有一种东西

I heard there is something in society.

像是这样

Like this.

我们就升往游戏家

We will ascend to gamers.

它和你的游戏

It and your game.

没有任何偶合

No coincidence at all.

你可以加讨好性的东西

You can add flattering elements.

那种感觉特别像

That feeling is very similar to.

但你得讨好到人的

But you have to please the person.

我昨天去健身房

I went to the gym yesterday.

然后发现那个动款单车

Then discovered that moving bike.

在放黑身化的音乐

In the music of darkness and body transformation.