第10回：閉店した岐阜高島屋へ「柳ヶ瀬ブルース」

渡辺です

This is Watanabe.

ちょっとね一人で喋るのも

It's a bit lonely talking by myself.

喋るのが久しぶりなんですね

It's been a while since we talked, hasn't it?

悩む人たちの方もですね

As for those who are struggling,

反省の会の方は

How is the reflection meeting going?

ちょっとしばらくお休みしてまして

I've been taking a little break.

お休みするつもりでやってるわけじゃないんですけども

It's not that I'm doing this with the intention of taking a break.

ただなんで

Just why?

休んでるかっていうところまで

Until the point of wondering if you're resting.

話すとね

When I speak, you know...

それを話せないから休んでるってことになっちゃうんでね

It's turned into a situation where I can't talk about it, so I'm taking a break.

なんともあれなんですが

Well, in any case...

簡単に言うと今の状態で

To put it simply, in the current state...

一人で話し始めると

When I start talking by myself,

この場でお話し

Let's talk here.

お聞かせするには

To tell you about it.

ふさわしくないことしかないので

There is nothing but inappropriate things.

結果的にカットするか

Will it be cut as a result?

黙るか

Shall we be quiet?

しかなくなっちゃうから

Because it will end up being unavoidable.

ということになるんでしょうね

I suppose that would be the case.

これは別に悩む人たちの

This is for those who are struggling.

ゆたかさんとかケンとか

Yutaka-san and Ken, etc.

今回エースさんとして

This time as Ace-san

ちーたいさんが来てくださいましたけど

Chitai-san has come, but...

そういった方たちとに関連する

Related to those people.

何かっていうことじゃなくて

It's not about something specific.

もう完全に俺のね

It's totally mine now.

俺個人の環境によるところなんですけど

It's based on my individual environment.

なんでね

Why?

そっちの方をちょっと楽しみにしてくださってる方には

For those who are looking forward to that part a little bit.

申し訳ないんですが

I'm sorry, but...

楽しみにしてくれている

Looking forward to it.

ものに

To things

応えるものができないと

If there is nothing to respond with.

いうふうにちょっと今は思ってます

I'm thinking a little like this right now.

ただね

Just, you know.

せっかく岐阜に出張に行ってきましたんで

Since I went all the way to Gifu on a business trip,

これは自分用の記録に

This is for my personal record.

残しておきたいと思います

I want to keep it.

2回岐阜に行ってきました

I went to Gifu twice.

えー

Eh?

いつだっけ

When was it?

最近行ったのはこの前の7月の

The last time I went was in July.

30、31それから8月1日の

30, 31, and then August 1st.

203日で行ってきたんだけど

I went for 203 days.

その2ヶ月近く前も

Almost two months ago as well.

行ってきたんですよ

I've been there.

事前取材ってことで

It's for a pre-interview.

で何の取材かっていうと

So what kind of interview is it?

岐阜の高島屋

Takashimaya in Gifu

デパートがね

It's the department store.

閉店すると

When the store closes.

これはもっと前に告知があったんだけど

This was announced much earlier.

えー

Uh...

えー岐阜の

Uh, Gifu's...

高島屋デパートがなくなって

The Takashimaya department store has disappeared.

今度岐阜県からデパートがゼロになるってこと

This means that soon there will be no department stores left in Gifu Prefecture.

だったんですよ

It was that way.

全国で4番目

Fourth in the country.

えー山形が

Well, Yamagata is...

小沼デパートがね

It's about the Konuma Department Store.

2020年の1月に破綻したから

Because it went bankrupt in January 2020.

全国で一番最初に

The very first in the country.

デパートがなくなった県なんだけど

It's a prefecture without a department store.

そっから徳島、島根と来て

From there, I went to Tokushima and then Shimane.

で今回

So this time

7月31日に岐阜の高島屋が

On July 31, Takashimaya in Gifu will...

閉まるってことで

It means "That means it's closing."

これで全国4番目ってことになると

This means we would be the fourth in the nation.

で今デパート新聞っていうところに

So now I'm at this place called the department store newspaper.

連載をね

A series, you know.

月2回の連載をもらってるんだけど

I receive a bi-monthly serialization.

今のその連載のテーマっていうのが

The theme of the current series is...

えーそういったデパートがなくなってしまうところ

Well, places like that department store are disappearing.

それが残り一つになってるところ

That's where it has become the last one remaining.

うーん

Hmm.

でまぁこれはまだやったことがないんだけど

Well, I haven't done this yet, but...

地方デパートでうまくちゃんとやってるところ

A地方 department store that is doing well and properly.

っていうとこ

That being said.

ものをね

About things, you know.

現地に行って取材して

Go to the site and conduct an interview.

町の人から話を聞いて

I heard stories from the townspeople.

その町においてのデパート

Department store in that town.

っていうのが今どういう存在で

What kind of existence is that now?

それは昔と比べてどう変わってきたんだ

How has it changed compared to the past?

っていうのを

That's what I'm saying.

うーんその町でね

Hmm, in that town...

うんその町でね

Yeah, in that town.

町の人の記憶に頼りながら書いていこうっていう

"I'll write while relying on the memories of the townspeople."

えー連載をやってるわけですよ

Well, I'm doing a series.

うん

Yeah.

で前回郡山をやって

So last time we did Koriyama...

郡山の薄い百貨店っていうところをテーマにやって

I'm doing a theme based on a thin department store in Koriyama.

それはあのまあ県に来てもらって

Well, I would like you to come to that prefecture.

話をしたところなんだけど

I just had a conversation about it.

まあそれを4回連載した後は

Well, after that, it will be serialized four more times.

いよいよ7月の末に

Finally, at the end of July.

閉まる岐阜の高島屋だろう

It must be Takashimaya in Gifu that is closing.

っていうことで

So that's it.

えーまあこれはね

Well, this is...

2回に分けて取材してきました

I conducted the interview in two parts.

でまあそれが

Well, that is...

えーあの平定を見届けて

Um, to witness the pacification.

山形に帰ってきました

I have returned to Yamagata.

っていうのが今回の話なんだけど

That's the story this time.

うん

Yeah.

その事前取材の時に

During that pre-interview.

行った時はねまだ

When I went there, it was still...

寒くはないけど涼しかったんですよ

It wasn't cold, but it was cool.

5月とか6月とかそんな

Like May or June or something.

5月か5月の後半

May or the latter half of May.

うん

Yeah.

それも2泊で行って

Let's go for two nights as well.

来て

Come here.

まずは一応閉店はすでに発表されてるんだけど

First of all, the closure has already been announced, but...

じゃあその

Well then, that...

デパートがなくなるってことが分かった

I understood that department stores are going to disappear.

岐阜って今どんな状態なんだろう

I wonder what the situation in Gifu is like now.

特に百貨店のある商店街ね

Especially the shopping district with the department store.

まあどうなんだろうってのは見てきたわけです

Well, I guess I've seen what that's like.

第1回目はね

This is the first time.

で岐阜の

In Gifu,

えー商店街の中に

Um, in the shopping street...

商店街中心商店街っていうとね

When you talk about the central shopping district, you mean...

柳瀬っていうところになるんですよ

It's called Yanase.

JR岐阜駅から

From JR Gifu Station

だいたい歩いて

About walking.

10分から15分ぐらい

About 10 to 15 minutes.

えー

Eh?

歩く速さにもよりますけどね

It depends on the walking speed, though.

俺の足でだいたい

About with my feet.

10分ちょっとぐらいかな

It should be about 10 minutes or so.

うんでもね

Well, you know...

まあ駅から離れてるなって印象です

Well, it gives the impression that it's far from the station.

商店街って

What is a shopping district?

ただこれはどこもそうなんだけどね

But this is the case everywhere, you know.

山形も基本的にじゃあ

Basically, Yamagata too then.

あの中心商店街でどこかっていうと

If you're asking about where in the central shopping district...

七日町

Nanakamachi

うん

Yeah.

まあやっぱり駅から歩いて

Well, I guess I'll walk from the station after all.

10分ちょっとぐらいはかかるでしょ

It should take about 10 minutes or so.

うんそもそも

Yeah, to begin with.

駅っていうのは作るときに

When creating a station,

すでに出来上がってる商店街の

The already completed shopping district.

ね真横にドンとつけるわけには

I can't just slap it right next to me.

それは立地的にはいかないんで

That's not feasible in terms of location.

ちょっと離れたとこに作って

Make it a little farther away.

駅ができたことによって

Due to the establishment of the station

その周辺にまた商業施設ができて

Commercial facilities are being built again in that area.

っていう風になるんで

So it will be like that.

まあそれ離れてるのはしょうがないんだけど

Well, it's understandable that it's far away.

なんかやっぱり

Somehow, after all.

やっぱりね実際に駅から歩いてみると

As I thought, when I actually walk from the station...

遠いなってちょっと思った

I thought it was a bit far.

でいざ行ってみるとね

Well, when you actually go and try it...

まあ広いです

Well, it's spacious.

広い

Wide

山形の人口が二十数万人だけ

The population of Yamagata is only about 200,000.

で岐阜市の進行人口っていうのが

In Gifu City, the population is...

40万人なんですよ

It's 400,000 people.

だから倍近くある

That's why it's nearly twice as much.

でも商店街の規模で言ったら

But when it comes to the size of the shopping district...

七日町の倍以上あるかな?

Is it more than twice as much as Nakanoshima?

でも商店街の規模で言ったら七日町の倍以上あるかな?

But if we're talking about the scale of the shopping district, it might be more than twice that of Nanokamachi, right?

柳瀬商店街っていうのは

Yanase Shopping District is...

まあそこに高島屋が立ってんだけど

Well, there's Takashimaya standing over there.

ただね

Just that.

そうだな体感で言ったらね

Well, if I were to describe it from experience...

6割から7割近くがね

About 60% to nearly 70%.

もう閉店してます

We are already closed.

うん

Yeah.

シャッター街なんですよ

It's a shuttered street.

なんかね水曜日のダウンタウンで

Well, in "Wednesday Downtown"...

特集されたらしいんだけど

It seems like it was featured.

それは後から知ったんだけど

I found that out later.

なんかやっぱり日本一のシャッター街として

Somehow, it still feels like the number one shuttered shopping street in Japan.

岐阜の柳瀬商店街っていうのが

There is a shopping street called Yanase in Gifu.

紹介されてるらしいよね

Apparently, it seems like you’re being introduced.

もう本当に

Really now...

シャッターだらけ

Full of shutters.

あー

Ah-

今日お休みなのかなって思ったの

I was wondering if you're taking a break today.

最初行った時は

When I first went there,

平日だったしね火曜だったかな

It was a weekday, probably Tuesday.

で七日町も火曜日の

And on Tuesday in Nanakamachi

定休日っていうところ多いからさ

There are many places that have regular days off.

山形のね

It's from Yamagata.

それはなんか一説によると大沼が休みだった

According to one theory, Onuma was closed for a break.

かつてねどこに合わせたとか

Once, I adjusted it to fit somewhere.

それが商店街の

That's the shopping street.

協定でっていうのが

It's about the agreement.

名残として残っててっていう話を

It's about the story of something that remains as a remnant.

聞いたことがあるんだけど

I've heard about it.

それなら

In that case

どうかなって思うぐらい

I'm just wondering how it might be.

シャッターだらけなんですよ

It's full of shutters.

うん

Yeah.

でポツポツ開いてるお店もあるんだけど

There are some shops that are opening little by little.

人が入ってるわけじゃないし

It's not like there's anyone inside.

そもそも商店街にほとんど人が歩いてない

There are hardly any people walking in the shopping district in the first place.

でじゃあ高島屋

Well then, Takashimaya.

もうこれはなくなるっていう

This is going to be gone soon.

もう数ヶ月後には閉店するっていう風になってるんだから

It's said that it will be closing in a few months.

と思って行ってみるけど

I thought I would give it a try, but...

やっぱガラガラなんだよね

It's still pretty empty, isn't it?

ここはもう山形と同じ

This is just like Yamagata now.

1階の化粧品売り場にはポツポツやっぱり

The cosmetic department on the first floor has some spots after all.

そのみなりの綺麗な

That beautiful appearance.

おばあちゃんとかいる

I have a grandmother and others.

でも2階以上には

But above the second floor...

もうほとんど人がいない

There are almost no people left.

せいぜい書店があるんだけど

At most, there is a bookstore.

上の階にね高い高層階の方に

To the upper floor, to the high-rise higher up.

そこにまあ

Well, there.

他の階と比べれば

Compared to other floors.

人はいるかなっていう状態で

I wonder if there are people around.

一番人がいるのはやっぱり

The place with the most people is definitely...

地下の食料品売り場

Basement grocery store

でそこに

So there.

山形でいうね

I'll say it in Yamagata.

アジマンってあるでしょ

Isn't there something called ajiman?

アジマン焼きとか今谷焼きって

Aji-man yaki and Imaya yaki, huh?

あの地方によって変わるけど

It varies depending on the region.

山形で言えば

Speaking of Yamagata...

アジマンを売ってるお店があって

There is a store selling ajiman.

そこだけはね

That's the only place.

唯一ちょっとした行列ができてた

There was just a little bit of a line.

平日のそうだな

On a weekday, I guess.

まだ10時とか11時とかそんな感じだよ

It's still around 10 or 11 o'clock.

ここのお店は人気なんだなと思って見るけど

I look and think that this shop is popular, but...

まあどうやら岐阜発祥でなくて

Well, it seems it's not originated from Gifu after all.

あれはどこだ

Where is that?

京都じゃない兵庫では兵庫か

It's not Kyoto, it's Hyogo, right?

その辺りかな

Around there, I guess.

ん

Hmm.

後座候ってね

I'm waiting in the back seat.

まあ山形で言うと

Well, speaking of Yamagata...

味まんなんだけど

It's a flavor man, though.

味まんだとは

What is "aji manda"?

あんことクリームチーズでしょ

It's red bean paste and cream cheese, right?

開け込めカスタードクリームか

Is it filled with custard cream?

うん

Yeah.

だけど

However

後座候はなんか赤と白って別れてて

The back seat is somehow divided into red and white.

まああんことシローアントっていう

Well, it's called Anko and Shiro Ant.

ことだったのかな

I wonder if that was the case.

ん

Hmm.

でもせいぜいそれぐらいよ

But that's about it.

ほんとガラガラだなあと思って

I really thought it was empty.

うーん

Hmm.

ん

Hmm.

うん

Yeah.

ん

Hmm.

でいろいろ回ってね

So, let's go around and explore various places.

その空いてるお店を探して

Please find that vacant store.

訪ねて昔からやってそうなお店に話を聞いて

I visited and heard stories from a shop that has been around for a long time.

とかってやるとさ

If you do it like that, you know...

やっぱりまあどこもそうだと思うんだけど

I guess it's the same everywhere, after all.

昔っていうのは

In the old days,

この柳瀬商店街っていうのも

This Yanase shopping district too

人と人と肩をぶつけて歩いてたもんなんだよ

People used to walk shoulder to shoulder, bumping into each other.

なんて聞かされるわけだよ

What do you mean by that?

そんなのは郡山でも聞いたし

I've heard that even in Koriyama.

山形でも散々聞いたんだけど

I heard it a lot in Yamagata too.

どこもそうだったんだなって思うわけ

I think that's how it was everywhere.

今でさえ人口40万人いるとこだからね

It already has a population of 400,000 now.

それはなおさらそうだったんでしょう

That must have been even more the case.

っていうふうに思うんだけど

I think that's how it is.

岐阜っていうのはね

Gifu is...

山形とちょっと事情が違って

It's a bit different from the situation in Yamagata.

かといって郡山と事情がそんなに違うわけでもない

That said, the situation in Koriyama isn't that different either.

どういうことかっていうと

What I mean is

柳瀬っていうのは男の欲望を掻き立てて

Yanase stirs up a man's desires.

栄えてきたっていう側面があるわけですね

There is an aspect that suggests it has flourished.

まあ夜のお店がいっぱいあったわけですよ

Well, there were a lot of night spots.

これについてはね

About this...

まあみんな口を揃えて言いますよ

Well, everyone says the same thing.

例えばそのまだね

For example, that still...

公務員の接待とかがあった頃っていうのは

Back when there were things like receptions for public servants...

県の職員とかがあった時は

When there were prefectural officials and such.

柳瀬にやってきてね

Come to Yanase, okay?

いわゆるほら今問題になってるけど

It's the so-called issue that's being talked about now.

裏金っていうやつがあって

There's something called "under-the-table money."

それをバンバンバンバン使うわけですよお店で

You use it a lot in the store.

もうほんと何十万っていう領収書切ったっていうことが

It's really the case that I've issued receipts for hundreds of thousands.

あったりもしたな

That happened sometimes too.

っていうことを言ってる

I'm saying that.

居酒屋のおばちゃんなんかもいましたけどね

There were also old ladies working in the izakaya, you know.

でそういうことができなくなってから

Since I became unable to do such things.

世間の目が厳しくなってからっていうのもあるし

It's also because people's eyes have become stricter.

それから飲酒運転だよね

And then there's drunk driving, right?

みんな車で柳瀬にやってきたわけですよ

Everyone came to Yanase by car.

で酒を飲んで

Drinking alcohol.

そのまま車で帰っていく

Just drive home like that.

そういうことができたから

Because I was able to do that.

たくさんの人が柳瀬で遊んだと

Many people played at Yanase.

で今はそういうことは当然できない

So now, that's obviously not possible.

まあそれはね

Well, that's that.

昔が良かったっていうわけじゃないですよ

It's not that the past was better.

それで起こった事故で

In the accident that occurred because of that.

亡くなった方っていうのは

The people who have passed away

それは多くないですよね

That's not a lot, is it?

たくさんいたでしょう

There were probably a lot of them.

それが問題になって

That has become a problem.

今そういうことをしないようにしましょうって

Let's not do that kind of thing now.

厳罰化されてるわけだからね

Because it has been made more severely punishable.

それは必要な措置だったと思うんだけど

I think it was a necessary measure.

じゃあなぜ柳瀬っていうのが元気がなくなってきたかって

So, why has Yanase been losing energy?

いうことを考えた時は

When I thought about what to say,

やっぱりそういった環境の変化があったっていう

I guess there was indeed a change in the environment.

まあ一つこれは一つの分析ね

Well, this is one analysis.

こういうのね

This kind of thing, huh?

混同する人がいるからね

Because there are people who get confused.

念を押して言っとくけど

Just to emphasize, let me say this.

これ昔が良かったって言ってるわけじゃないのね

I'm not saying that the past was better.

こういうことがあったっていうことでね

This is something that happened, you see.

で

So,

じゃあ

Well then.

まあそういった

Well, that's how it is.

まあいわゆる

Well, so to speak.

官官接待官民接待っていうものがなくなってきた

The practice of government-to-government and government-to-private hospitality is fading away.

プラス飲酒運転が厳しくなってきた

Plus, drunk driving has become stricter.

柳瀬からお客が離れていった

Customers have left Yanase.

でもそこにとどめをさせた存在っていうのがあって

But there is an existence that put an end to it there.

これはね

This is

やっぱり現地には行かなきゃいけないなと思うんだけど

I still think I need to go to the actual location.

インターネットに行かないといけないんだけど

I have to go on the internet.

インターネットで調べても柳瀬衰退の原因って

Even when I search on the internet, the reason for the decline of Yanase is...

まあ他の理由はいろいろ出てくるんだけど

Well, various other reasons come up.

これは出てこなかったなっていう話があって

There's a story that didn't come up.

でもみんな現場で行く話を聞くと

But when everyone hears the stories happening on-site,

口をそろえて言うことがある

There are things we all say in unison.

それがね2012年の国体なんです

That's the national sports festival from 2012.

岐阜の

of Gifu

震災の翌年だね

It's the year after the earthquake disaster.

2011年に東日本大震災があって

There was the Great East Japan Earthquake in 2011.

そこからね

From there.

復興支援っていう名目で

Under the pretext of disaster recovery support.

国体っていうのが

What is meant by "kokutai"?

そういった看板を掲げるようになるんだね

So that's when they start putting up signs like that.

2012年

2012 year

翌年ですよ

It's the following year.

岐阜で国体が行われるんだけど

The national sports festival will be held in Gifu.

全国からたくさんの選手がやってくる

Many athletes are coming from all over the country.

それプラス

That plus.

当然ね政治家もやってくれば

Of course, politicians will also come.

天皇陛下もやってくるってことになるわけですよ

It means that His Majesty the Emperor will also be coming.

それはどこでやっても同じだけど

It's the same no matter where you do it.

そうすると

If that's the case.

柳瀬みたいに

Like Yanase.

夜のお店がうじゃうじゃあって

There are so many night spots.

そこに男が群がってるようなところは

It seems like there is a place where men are gathering.

けしからんっていうか

It's outrageous, I would say.

そういった外からのお客様をもてなすのに

To entertain such guests from outside.

良くないだろうっていうことになったらしいんですよ

It seems that it was decided that it wouldn't be good.

上の方でね

Up above.

街からそれは自分から言わないですよ

I won't say that from myself in the street.

いわゆる岐阜県の方針として

As the so-called policy of Gifu Prefecture,

この街を浄化しようっていうことになったわけ

It was decided that we would purify this town.

そういうのが

Things like that.

で柳瀬商店街のいわゆる賑わいの核を握ったところが

The part that holds the so-called core of the bustling Yanase shopping district.

もう一気に営業をやめさせられたっていうことらしいんです

It seems they were suddenly forced to stop their business entirely.

この時間だけ休んでくれとか

Please just take a break for this time.

よそで商売やってくれじゃなくて

"Don't do business elsewhere."

廃業に追い込まれたということを言ってた

They were saying that they were forced to close their business.

それが今の柳瀬商店街のシャッター街を作った大きな原因だし

That is a major reason for the current shuttered state of Yanase Shopping Street.

柳瀬にはね

In Yanase.

中心エリアと東と西とっていうふうに

In terms of the central area and the east and west.

3つに分かれてるんだけど

It's divided into three parts.

西っていうのがね

It's about the west.

特にその

Especially that.

いわゆる水商売の人たちが集まってたところなんだけど

It was a place where people in the so-called "water trade" gathered.

そこはね

That place is...

もう

Already

8割ぐらい閉まってる

It's about 80% closed.

うん

Yeah.

看板だけが残ってる

Only the sign remains.

うん

Yeah.

で彼女で客引きもいるんだけど

There are also people who solicit customers with her.

空いてる店はほとんどいない

There are hardly any shops that are open.

ないっていう

They say it doesn't exist.

本当に凄まじい状態なんですよ

It's really an incredible situation.

うん

Yeah.

昔から商売やってる人に聞くとやっぱりその国体だ

When you ask people who have been in business for a long time, it really comes down to the national character.

岐阜の人は真面目だからって言ってたよね

They said that people from Gifu are serious, right?

あるおばあちゃんはね

There was an old lady.

うどん屋さんやってるおばあちゃんはね

The grandma who runs the udon shop, you know.

岐阜は真面目なんだよって

Gifu is serious, you know.

商店街としてはこんなとこまで天皇陛下が見に来るはずないだろって

I didn't expect His Majesty the Emperor to come and visit a place like this in the shopping district.

反対したらしいんだけど

It seems that they opposed it.

聞き入れてもらえず

Not being listened to.

結局

In the end.

うーん

Hmm.

店は閉まって

The store is closed.

当然それを目当てにしてきたお客さんっていうのは

Of course, the customers who came with that in mind are...

足は遠のくわけだ

That's why the feet don't come near.

どこに行くかっていうと

Where I'm going is...

名古屋で遊んでるわけですよ

I'm having fun in Nagoya.

前はね

It was before.

むしろ名古屋から岐阜に遊びに来てた人も多かったらしいんだけど

It seems that many people also came from Nagoya to visit Gifu.

もう

Already

わざわざ来る理由がなくなった

There's no longer a reason to come all the way here.

でこの名古屋っていうのが大事なんですよね

So this Nagoya thing is important, isn't it?

岐阜にとって

For Gifu.

うん

Yeah.

岐阜にとって

For Gifu

山形から仙台って

From Yamagata to Sendai.

山形と仙台との関係性って似たようなこと言われる

The relationship between Yamagata and Sendai is often said to be similar.

ね

Okay.

山形の人は買い物にする

People in Yamagata go shopping.

買い物するに行く

I'm going shopping.

遊びに行く

Go out to play.

ね

Right?

なんか俺さっき変なこと言った

I said something weird earlier.

買い物するに行くって言ったね

You said you were going shopping.

うん

Yeah.

ちょっとねお酒飲んでくかな

I'm going to have a little drink.

ごめんなさい

I'm sorry.

えーと買い物に行くにしても

Well, even if I'm going shopping...

遊びに行くにしても

Even if I go out to play,

仙台に行くなんてことは昔から言われてたわけだ

It's been said for a long time that one should go to Sendai.

でも俺も高校生になってアルバイト始めた

But I also started working part-time after becoming a high school student.

時バイト代もらったらやっぱり仙台の方に行ってなんてことやってたからね

When I got my part-time wages, I was thinking about going to Sendai and doing things like that.

高速バスに乗って

Take an express bus.

うん

Yeah.

どんどんどんどん山形から仙台に人が座れていく

People are increasingly moving from Yamagata to Sendai.

ね山形に住んで仙台で働くって人も多いでしょ

Many people live in Yamagata and work in Sendai, right?

午前中にさ

In the morning.

午前中とか朝だ

It's the morning, like in the morning.

山形からその仙台駅のバス停に

From Yamagata to that bus stop at Sendai Station.

行ってみればわかるよ

You'll understand if you try it.

うん

Yeah.

たくさん人いる人がね

There are many people.

今から出勤しますって人が

Someone who says they're going to work now.

並べてるよ

I'm arranging it.

でからさバス停に それでも1時間くらいです

It takes about an hour to get to the bus stop from there.

じゃあ岐阜地岐阜と 名古屋って

So, what about Gifu and Nagoya?

jr の8快速電車で何分で行き来できるか ちょっと想像してみてい

I’m trying to imagine how many minutes it would take to travel back and forth on the JR rapid train.

まあ一応愛知県と岐阜県となり合ってる件 ですけど

Well, it’s about the fact that Aichi Prefecture and Gifu Prefecture are neighboring areas.

これね20分なんですよ

This is 20 minutes.

20分だよ 20分ってことは山形で行ったってまあ隣の市に車で行くにしたって20分くらいかかるよね

It’s 20 minutes. That means, whether you're going to Yamagata or driving to the neighboring city, it takes about 20 minutes, right?

それを

That.

まあそれ駅に行くまでの手間はあるにしたって 一旦電車に乗っちゃえば20分で日本3番ってかの大都会名古屋に着くわけ

Well, even though there's the hassle of getting to the station, once you get on the train, you'll arrive in the big metropolis of Nagoya, Japan's third largest city, in just 20 minutes.

そりゃさ

Well, you know...

移動できる人はみんな

Everyone who can move

そりゃさ

Well, you see...

そっちに行くよっていう話なんだ だから

It's about saying I'm going over there, so...

もう家賃とか地代の安い岐阜に住んで名古屋で働いてるって人もたくさんいるし 休みの日にじゃあ飲みに行こう買い物に行こうってなったら名古屋にっていう若い人はいっぱいいる

Many people live in Gifu, where rent and land prices are low, and work in Nagoya. When it comes to going out for drinks or shopping on their days off, there are many young people who head to Nagoya.

わけそうじゃなくても郊外にね いわゆるイオンモールみたいなものがあるから

Even if we don't split up, there are things like the so-called Aeon malls in the suburbs.

ん もうわざわざ岐阜に行かないと何だろうなぁないものをすっ

Hmm, I wonder what it is that I have to go all the way to Gifu for, even though I don't have anything.

ん

Mm.

なくなったらいわゆるその夜のお店のたくさんこう並んでるような街並みがなくなったら わざわざ岐阜で飲む必要なんかないじゃんって言う

If the streets lined with all those night shops were to disappear, then there would be no reason to go all the way to Gifu to drink, would there?

ことなんですよ

It's that kind of thing.

でまぁそれが顕著に現れている例っていうのが 一つあって俺はねええええええある居酒屋さんで聞いたんですよじゃあ名古屋で

Well, there's a notable example of that, and I heard it at an izakaya in Nagoya.

の人が 岐阜に今でも遊びに来る買い物に来るとかそういった

People still come to Gifu to play and shop.

向こうから来ることってないんですかって聞いたら そしたらねいやあんだよって言った

When I asked if they would ever come from that side, they said, "Well, actually, they do."

ただ柳瀬じゃなくて 金津園っていうところがある

It's not just Yanase; there's a place called Kanazuen.

そこっていうのはソープ街 うん

That place is a soap land, yeah.

それだけが唯一 岐阜の人を集める強みとして残っているにしたって

That's the only strength that remains to gather people from Gifu.

それだけが唯一 岐阜の人を集める強みとして残ってるにしたって

Even if that's the only strength that continues to attract people from Gifu.

ねかなり衰えてるらしいんだけど

It seems like it's quite deteriorated, though.

ねまあ予想されたって言う

Well, I guess it was expected.

に鯖に来る人がいたらソープだって言う

If there are people coming to the mackerel (fish), I’ll say it's soap.

ああああああ

Aaaaaa

っていうことなんです

That's what it means.

だからこういう話で嫌悪感を持つ人ってのはやっぱ、少なからずいると思う

I think there are definitely some people who feel disgusted by stories like this.

そこで働いてる人にだってねいろんな境遇が

Even the people working there have various circumstances.

あるだろうし

There might be.

みんな進んで働いてるわけじゃないと

Not everyone is working hard.

やむにやまれずとか

"Unavoidably or out of necessity."

選択肢がなくなって

Without any options left.

そういった業界に入らざるを得なかった人もいるだろうから

There may be people who had no choice but to enter such industries.

だから

Therefore

それがなければな

If it weren't for that, then.

っていう風に

In that way

簡単に言えないなっていうのは思うんだけど

I think it's not something I can easily say.

でも

But

名古屋とギフトの関係を

The relationship between Nagoya and gifts.

一つ冷静に考えた場合は

If you think about it calmly,

そういった分析が

Such analysis

できますっていうことなのね

So that means it can be done.

何にしてもやっぱり

Whatever the case, as expected...

人の欲望っていうのを

The desires of people

捕まえないと

I have to catch it.

足っていうのは動かせないんだなっていう風には

"I feel that my legs can't move."

思うわけ

The reason I think.

それは食欲であり性欲であり

It is both hunger and lust.

だから

So.

この女の子に会いたいとか

I want to meet this girl.

これが食べたいんだっていう

I want to eat this.

どうしても

No matter what.

人を動かす

To move people.

強みっていうのは街には必要なんだな

Strengths are necessary in the city, huh?

なんていう風に思う

I think it’s something like that.

思ったけど

I was thinking, but...

ギフについては

About Gifu.

いろんな社会の変化とか

Various social changes and so on.

国体とかで

At the national athletic meet, etc.

そういったものが

Things like that

どんどん奪われてしまって

It's being taken away more and more.

そのままになってるってことなんだな

It means that it's been left as it is.

その結果が高島屋の現状

That result is Takashimaya's current situation.

閉店してしまう

It's closing down.

閉店すると分かっても

Even knowing that it will close down

なかなか人が集まらないっていう

It seems that it's hard to gather people.

行く理由がないってことになってるんじゃないかな

I think it means there is no reason to go.

という風に思いました

I thought in that way.

でもなんだろうな

But what could it be?

あんまり弱ってる街に感情移入してるのが

I’m getting emotionally attached to a city that is really weak.

いわゆる弱者びいきみたいなさ

It's like the so-called favoritism towards the weak.

そういう風になると

When it turns out that way.

公平性を欠くかなと思うんだけど

I think it lacks fairness.

でもね

But you know.

感情移入はしちゃうんだよね

I can't help but get emotionally involved.

その街並みというかさ

It's about the townscape, or rather.

なんかこのどうしようもない

I don't know what to do about this.

やるせなさっていうものにね

It's something called helplessness.

なんていうことを思って

What kind of thing are you thinking?

最初の取材を

The first interview.

2泊3日終えて

After completing a 2-night, 3-day stay.

帰ってきたわけですよね

You're saying you've come back, right?

これが

This is

本当に閉店となったら

If it really closes down.

どうなるんだろうみたいな

I wonder what will happen.

商店会に

In the shopping district.

本当に人

Really a person.

平日っていうのはあるんだけど

There are weekdays, but...

でも土日でも全然人なんか歩いてないよ

But even on weekends, there aren't any people walking around at all.

っていう風に言ってるしね

They're saying it like that, right?

みんなね

Everyone, you know.

でも

But

I don't know

I don't know.

何か

Something

で

So, then, therefore

まあ取材の日程自体は

Well, the schedule for the interview itself is...

すでに2回目は決まってて

It's already been decided that there will be a second time.

閉店の前日

The day before closing.

7月30日に

On July 30th

岐阜に入って31

Entered Gifu at 31.

それから翌月の1日まで見て

Then, I’ll wait until the 1st of the following month.

閉店の前

Before closing.

閉店当日

Closing day.

閉店後の

After closing.

その街とか

That town and such.

岐阜県の反応

Response from Gifu Prefecture.

動きをちゃんと観察してきましょう

Let's properly observe the movements.

っていうことで

So, that's how it is.

決まってたんで

It was decided.

でこの度行ってきたわけですよ

So, I went on this occasion.

7月30日

July 30

まあ閉店の前日だよね

Well, it's the day before the closure.

高島屋ね

Takashimaya, huh?

えーと

Um...

岐阜に着いたのが

I arrived in Gifu.

2時ぐらいかな

It’s probably around 2 o’clock.

うん

Yeah.

2時半か

Is it 2:30?

でホテルにチェックインを

Check in to the hotel.

3時に済ませて

Finish it by 3 o'clock.

荷物置いてから

After putting down the luggage

えーと

Um...

まあそのホテル自体はね

Well, the hotel itself is...

駅から歩いて

Walking from the station.

10分ぐらいのとこだったんだけど

It was about 10 minutes away.

そこからさらに

From there even further

10分歩いて駅に引き返して

Walk for 10 minutes and then return to the station.

なんでかっていうと

The reason is that

自転車が1日1000円で借りられるんだよね

You can rent a bicycle for 1000 yen a day.

うん

Yeah.

それは前の取材の時も借りたんだけど

I borrowed it during the previous interview as well.

24時間1000円

1,000 yen for 24 hours.

で電動機

with an electric motor

なんだ

What is it?

電動アシスト付きか

Is it equipped with electric assist?

うん

Yeah.

自転車

Bicycle

普通の何にもアシストがないやつだと

It's a regular one without any assistance at all.

600円なんだけど

It's 600 yen.

1000円出すと

If you pay 1000 yen

あのアシスト付きのやつが借りられて

That one with the assist feature is borrowed.

めちゃくちゃ楽なんだよ

It's super easy.

乗ったことある?

Have you ever ridden it?

あの電動アシスト付きのやつが借りられてめちゃくちゃ楽なんだよ

That electric assist one you can rent is super convenient.

あの電動アシスト付きのやつ

That electric assist one.

おじいちゃんとかおばあちゃんが乗ってるやつでしょ

It's the one that grandpa or grandma rides, isn't it?

って思ってる人は

People who think like that...

1回試してみてもいいと思う

I think it's okay to give it a try once.

山形にもあくから

"Even in Yamagata, it's still bitter."

確か

Certainly

アシスト付きがあくか分かんないけど

I don't know if the one with assist is available or not.

そのレンタサイクル自体はあるから

The rental bicycles themselves are available.

本当にね

Really, yeah.

1時間2時間借りるだけでもいいから

Just borrowing it for one or two hours is fine.

あれ乗ってみるといいよ

You should try riding that.

すげー楽だから

It's super easy.

うん

Yeah.

でこの気温でしょ特に

It's this temperature, especially.

もう東京でさえ

"Even Tokyo now..."

前日東京にいたんだけど

I was in Tokyo the day before.

その時で40度

At that time, it was 40 degrees.

でさ

So, then.

岐阜もやっぱり

Gifu is also indeed...

34とか5とか

Like 34 or 35.

ずーっと晴れてるしね

It's been sunny the whole time.

だからそんなのにさ

So, about that...

あの歩いて

That walking.

ちょこちょこ

Little by little

取材なんかできないんですよ

I can't do any interviews.

なんでかって言うと死ぬから

The reason is that I'll die.

ね

Okay.

だからもうすぐ

So it will be soon.

自転車借りて

Rent a bicycle.

でそれで商店街まで行ったわけ

So that's why I went to the shopping district.

でね

So, you know...

今までまあ珍しく

So far, it's been quite rare.

まあ郡山もあったけどねアーケード

Well, there was an arcade in Koriyama too.

柳ヶ瀬にはアーケードが残ってて

The arcade is still intact in Yanagase.

あ

Ah.

アーケードの入り口が見えたなーってなると

I felt like I could see the entrance to the arcade.

高島屋もまもなく見えてくるんですよ

Takashimaya will soon come into view.

うん

Yeah.

その日は違ったね

That day was different, wasn't it?

やっぱり

As I thought.

もうアーケードの入り口に立ったというか

It's as if I've already stood at the entrance of the arcade.

自転車が侵入した時点でね

At the point when the bicycle intruded in.

人の塊が見えんだよある程度

I can somewhat see a mass of people.

でね

So, you know...

まあかといってそのね

Well, that being said...

百貨店に入れなくて

I can't enter the department store.

ずっと列を作ってるわけじゃなくて

It's not like we're always forming a line.

もうねやっぱり写真を撮ってんだね

You’re really taking pictures, aren’t you?

うん買い物を終えたい人なのか

Oh, is it someone who wants to finish shopping?

それとも今からを買い物する人なのか

Or are you someone who is going shopping now?

スマホをね掲げて

Holding up a smartphone.

あの正面玄関を撮ってるわけですよ

I'm taking a picture of that front entrance.

あーやっぱり状況変わってきてんなーと思って

Ah, I really feel like the situation is changing.

1階に入ると

When you enter the first floor

まあやっぱり同じ平日だったけど

Well, it turns out it was the same weekday after all.

人の入りは全然違ったかな

The number of people was completely different, huh?

うーん

Hmm.

明らかにフロアにいるお客さんの数が違う

The number of customers on the floor is clearly different.

まあそれもそのはずというかね

Well, it's no surprise, I guess.

あのー閉店セールやってるわけですよ

Um, we’re having a closing sale.

ね商品に20%オフとか30%オフとかついてて

There are discounts of 20% off or 30% off on the products.

まあ化粧品に関してはね

Well, regarding cosmetics...

前日の時点でもうほぼソールドアウトっていう風に

By the day before, it was already almost sold out.

えー何シールとかが貼られてる商品が

Um, products that have stickers or something on them.

そうだなー6割ぐらいあったのかな

I wonder, was it about 60%?

うーんで2階上がっても3階上がっても

Hmm, whether I go up to the second floor or the third floor...

その婦人服婦人用品とかも

That woman's clothing and women's goods, etc.

まあセール品にみんなが群がってる

Well, everyone is flocking to the sale items.

で人がもうスカスカだなーっていうところは

It's a place where there are already hardly any people.

売り切れてるっていう感じだったんですよ

It felt like they were sold out.

うんあーそりゃまあそうなるかーって

Yeah, I guess that's how it would turn out.

思い出作りもそうだけど

It's also about creating memories.

うんまあ安くなったら買いましょうって人たちも集まってるからねー

Well, there are also people gathering who say they'll buy if it becomes cheaper.

はいこれなら저傷つまるわなーなんて思って

Yes, I thought, "Well, if that's the case, it will be painful."

まあとりあえず地下1階は置いといて

Well, for now, let's leave the basement floor aside.

えー1階2階3階とずーっと上がってた

I kept going up from the first floor to the second floor and then to the third floor.

1階2階3階とずーっと上がってた

I kept going up from the first floor to the second and third floors.

うん

Yeah.

で上まで見て

Look up to the top.

あーもうすでにまあ閉店してるところもあってねー

Ah, there are already some places that have closed.

テナントによっては

Depending on the tenant.

特に食べ物関係は

Especially regarding food.

うんとぉよろしくお願いします

Sure, thank you very much.

一番上の階にレストランが4、4つから5つくらいあったのかな

There were about four or five restaurants on the top floor.

食べられるところが

Where it can be eaten

多分仕入れの関係でしょう

It’s probably due to procurement issues.

もう半分ぐらいはやってなかったような気がする

I feel like I haven't done about half of it.

見て回って最後に地下1階ってなったんだけど

I looked around and finally ended up at the basement level 1.

やっぱりそこはもう人がいっぱいいる

As expected, there are already a lot of people there.

だけど商品はかなり少ない

However, there are quite a few products.

特に生鮮商品

Especially fresh products.

生鮮食品

Fresh food.

魚とか肉とかは

Fish and meat, etc.

もうやっぱり余らせた方が大変だからっていうことなのかな

I guess it’s because it’s more difficult to end up with leftovers after all.

だいぶその棚とかショーケースに並んでるものは少なかったけど

The items on the shelves and display cases were considerably fewer.

やっぱりね一番目立つのがあれですよ

As I thought, the most noticeable thing is that.

五座僧侶です

I am a Gozamonk.

山形でいうアジマンね

It's called "Ajiman" in Yamagata.

その5月の末に行った時は

When I went at the end of May

そうだな

That's right.

人が並んでるって言ってもね

Even if you say there are people lined up...

せで7、8人ぐらいだったけど

There were about 7 or 8 people.

その閉店前日の7月30日

On July 30, the day before the closing.

時間で言えば

In terms of time

そうだな

That's right.

3時半

3:30

午後のね

In the afternoon.

ずらーっと並んでんの

They're lined up in a row.

もうフロアに収まりきらず

It's already overflowing from the floor.

なんだろうあの

I wonder what that is.

階段のところまで

To the stairs.

1階に続く

Leads to the first floor.

地上階に続く階段のところに並んでて

They are lined up at the stairs leading to the ground floor.

後ろの人に聞いたわけよ

I asked the person behind me.

これどのくらい並んでるんですかって言ったら

I asked how long the line is.

さっき店員さんが来て

A little while ago, the shop assistant came.

ここは1時間半

This is one and a half hours.

1時間半

1 hour and 30 minutes

待つって言われましたって

I was told to wait.

そうですかって

Is that so?

ちなみにこの岐阜の人にとって

By the way, for this person from Gifu...

岐阜の方にとってね

For the people of Gifu.

この五座僧侶っていうのは

These five seated monks...

やっぱり思い出の味なんですかって言うと

So when you say it's a taste of memories...

やっぱりそうなんだって

I knew it.

その方はね

That person is...

50代ぐらいだったけど

They looked to be around their 50s.

やっぱり小さい頃は

As expected, when I was small...

親が高島屋に来ると

When my parents come to Takashimaya

必ず買って帰ってくるんだって

"I'll definitely buy it and take it home."

お土産で

As a souvenir.

で冷凍できるもんだから

Because it can be frozen.

ちょっと多めに買っておいて

Buy a little extra.

その日に食べられない分は

The parts that cannot be eaten that day

冷凍庫に入れておいて

Put it in the freezer.

で電子レンジで食べたい時に

When you want to eat it in the microwave.

温めて食べてなんて

"Don't eat it heated."

いう話をするわけだ

That's the kind of story I'm sharing.

でいわゆるそのお父さんお母さんだって

So, in other words, it's those parents, too.

だった世代に聞いてみても

Even when I ask that generation,

やっぱり高島屋に買い物に来たら

I knew I would come shopping at Takashimaya.

五座僧侶を買って帰るんだって話を

I heard you are going to buy five monks and bring them home.

してるわけですよ

That's what's happening.

私ちょっと山形から来て

I came from Yamagata a little bit.

そういった事情にあまり詳しくないんだけど

I'm not very familiar with those circumstances.

なっていう風にするわけですよ

I’m going to do it like that, you know.

すると話をするとね

Then when I talk about it, you know?

喜んであの聞かせてくれるんですよ

I'm glad to hear that you will tell me.

思い出をね

Memories, huh?

うんでなんだ

Well, what is it?

ちょっとこれ

Just this.

正しくないかもしれないけど

It may not be correct, but...

その方が言ったら

If that person said it.

近鉄がね

Kintetsu, you know.

あまりに五座僧侶ってのが流行ってるらしいから

It seems that the "Gozasangyō" priests are quite popular.

じゃあ自分たちのとこでもって言って

"Then let's say it's at our place."

今川焼きってものを作ったんだと

I heard that they made something called imagawayaki.

でこれを流行らせようってなったんだけど

So we decided to try to make this popular.

やっぱり五座僧侶とは中の案の多いんだよなと

I guess there are a lot of ideas among the five monk seats.

あの案の美味しさが全然違うんだと

The deliciousness of that idea is completely different.

だから今川焼きよりも

So rather than imagawayaki,

どっちかって言ってやっぱり我々は

If I had to choose, I would say that we are...

五座僧侶なんだっていうことを

I heard that you are a monk of the five seats.

言ってました

They were saying.

まあいわゆる

Well, so to speak.

ソウルフードってやつなのかな

Is it called soul food?

なんていう風に思ってね

I was thinking something like that.

ありがとうございましたって話を

It's a story about saying thank you.

ね

Right?

あの聞かせてもらってお礼を言って

Thank you for letting me hear that.

そっからまた商店街

From there, it's the shopping street again.

いろいろ回ってなんていうこと

What do you mean by going around various places?

で最終日に備えたんだけどね

I prepared for the final day, you know.

まあ

Well...

ちょっとね

Just a little.

かなりはしょってます

It's quite abbreviated.

いろいろありました

There were various things that happened.

テパートに関係ないことでもいろいろあったんだけど

There were various things that happened that were unrelated to the department.

それまで話し始めると本当に何も

Until then, if I start talking, really nothing...

話し進まないというか

It's not that the conversation isn't progressing.

全然関係ない話になるんで

This will be a completely unrelated topic.

この辺のストックは

The stock around here is...

なんかどっかの機会で話せたらいいな

I hope we can talk somewhere sometime.

という風に思うんだけど

I think that's how it is.

本当に岐阜っていうのは

"It's true that Gifu is..."

うーと

U-to

誤解があったらしょうがないんだけど

If there was a misunderstanding, then there's nothing we can do about it.

いい面も悪い面も含めて

Including both the good aspects and the bad aspects.

魅力的な街

An attractive city.

だなという風に思いました

I thought that it was so.

あー

Ah-

本当に素晴らしいなといったこともあれば

There are things that are truly wonderful.

これ一体何なんだ

What on earth is this?

っていう落ち込んだというか

It's more like I felt down.

愕然とした部分もあったけども

There were parts that left me astonished, but...

まあ人間と一緒で

Well, just like humans.

そういったものの両輪でね

In that way, it's like two wheels working together.

人間の魅力っていうのは作られていくのと一緒で

The charm of a person is something that is cultivated over time.

街っていうのもそうなんだなという風に思ったけど

I thought that cities are like that too.

まあ今回は

Well, this time...

取材に関係があるところだけを

Only the parts related to the interview.

ちょっとかいつまんで話すけれども

I'll summarize it a bit.

まあいわゆる

Well, so to speak.

うーんなんていうかな

Hmm, how should I put it?

せいだくの

of purification

だくの部分も味わいながら

While savoring the part of the flavor.

一日目を終えて

After finishing the first day.

翌日は

The next day.

閉店の日ですよいよいよ

It's the day of closing, finally.

百貨店だから開店は10時なんだけれど

Since it's a department store, it opens at 10 o'clock.

うん

Yeah.

そうだな朝起きたのが6時半ぐらいに起きたのかな

Yeah, I think I woke up around 6:30 in the morning.

でお風呂入って

So I took a bath.

で朝ごはん

For breakfast.

なんか食べたのか食べてないか

Did you eat something or not?

うんとりあえず

Well, for now…

なんかまあちょっとやんなきゃいけない人物の中でね

Well, among the people I have to deal with, there's just something.

ホテルは出たんですよね自転車にまたがってね

I left the hotel, right after getting on my bicycle.

電動アシスト付き自転車ですよね

It's an electric assist bicycle, right?

ホテルから

From the hotel.

スイスイスイと5分ぐらいで行けるわけですよ

You can get there smoothly in about 5 minutes.

さすがにね8時半前ぐらいですから

As expected, it's around before 8:30.

開店まで

Until the store opens.

まあ1時間半ぐらい

Well, about an hour and a half.

誰もいないだろうなと思って

I thought there wouldn't be anyone here.

いなかったらいなかったら

If there isn't anyone, if there isn't anyone.

どっか喫茶店にでも入ってね

"Why don't you just go into a café or something?"

その辺の世間話を

Some casual talk about the neighborhood.

盗み聞きするだけで結構

Just eavesdropping is enough.

勉強になるからさ

Because it's educational.

じゃあそうしようと思ったんだけど

Well, I was thinking of doing that.

もうすでにね

Already, you know.

照明玄関の前にね

In front of the illuminated entrance.

20人くらいの列できてるんですよ

There's a line of about 20 people.

と思ったら

I thought so.

もうね

Already, huh?

鉄柵で

With iron bars.

何か囲いとかができてて

It seems that some kind of enclosure has been made.

行列を整理するようになってるんだね

It seems like it's organized to manage the queue.

でね

So, you know...

岐阜高島屋っていうのは

Gifu Takashimaya is...

47年間営業したらしいんだけど

It seems they have been in business for 47 years.

最終日は

The last day is

先着470人に

First 470 people.

これ47にあやかって

This is in honor of 47.

なぞらやって

Do it like a tracing.

先着470人に高島屋のいわゆる

The first 470 people will receive what is known as Takashimaya's...

象徴であるバラを

The rose, which is a symbol.

配りますよっていうことを

I will distribute it.

やってたんだね

So you were doing it, huh?

だからそこに並んでる人っていうのは

So the people lined up there are...

その

That

先着470人に

First 470 people.

ちゃんと入るように早めに並んでる

I’m lined up early to make sure I get in properly.

バラをもらうために並んでるってこと

It means that you are lining up to receive a rose.

すごいなーなーと思って

I thought it was amazing.

ちょっとその様子を

Just a little of that situation.

遠まきに写真撮ったりしたんだけど

I took some pictures from a distance.

だんだんね

Little by little.

俺も欲しいかもっていう風に

I might want it too.

思っちゃったんだね

I guess you thought that, huh?

ちょっとほんと地元の人に申し訳ないな

I really feel sorry for the locals.

っていう風に思うんだけど

I think that's how it is.

俺なんてさ

I’m just someone like that.

たかだかその

Just that.

うん

Yeah.

前に5月の末に来たっきり

I came here at the end of May and haven't been back since.

ですよ

It is.

取材して健康にするとはいえ

Even though it’s said to be for health through coverage...

結局それになってお金もらってやってるわけだからさ

In the end, I'm doing it for the money, after all.

なんかそんな人間が

Somehow, someone like that.

と思ったんだけど

I thought so, but...

なんかやっぱりここはもらうべき

I guess I should take this after all.

うん

Yes.

健康の質を高めるためにも

To enhance the quality of health.

もらうべき

Should receive

しかもラジオで喋りたいみたいな

Moreover, it seems like they want to talk on the radio.

そういった下心もあって

With such ulterior motives in mind.

並びましたよ29番目ぐらいだよ

We’ve lined up, and we’re around 29th in line.

で並んでる人の話を

About the people standing in line.

この話ができればいいけど

I wish I could talk about this.

あとは聞こえてくる話を

"Then, just listen to what you hear."

なんとか覚えておくだけでも

Just remembering it somehow is enough.

いいだろうなーなんて思って

I was thinking, "That would be nice."

それそれで結構収穫があったんだけどね

Well, there were quite a few gains from that too.

並んでる間の1時間半っていうのは

The hour and a half spent waiting in line...

うん

Yeah.

列に加わって

Join the line.

9時になったら50人に増えました

By 9 o'clock, it had increased to 50 people.

9時15分になったら

When it becomes 9:15.

100人ぐらいになったかなって思ったんだけど

I was thinking that it might be around 100 people.

やっぱり開店30分前ってので

As I thought, it's 30 minutes before opening.

ね

Right?

一気に2倍3倍に増えて

Suddenly increasing by two or three times.

後から聞いたんだけど

I heard this later, but...

もう9時半に来た人は

Anyone who has arrived by 9:30.

あのもう

Oh, come on.

締め切りましたって言われたらしい

I heard they said it has been closed.

だからやっぱり開店

So, after all, it's opening.

30分前ぐらいは目処に

About 30 minutes ago as a rough estimate.

目安に来てた人が多かったんだね

It seems that there were many people who came as a guideline, huh?

爆発的にそこから人が増えて

The number of people increased explosively from there.

もう470人はいっぱいになっちゃった

It's already full with 470 people.

で開店そうだな10分前ぐらいから

It seems like the store will open about 10 minutes from now.

お店に動きがあって

There's some activity at the store.

うーんなんかね

Hmm, something like that...

お店に来たマスコットキャラクターって

The mascot character that came to the store is...

これは高島屋のじゃなくて岐阜なのかな

Is this not from Takashimaya but from Gifu?

岐阜にゆかりがあるキャラクターが

A character related to Gifu.

その入り口でおでん迎えするために

To greet with oden at that entrance.

準備なんていうことでね

It's just about preparation.

やってくるとこの行列した人から

When they come, from this line of people.

拍手が起こったりしてね

There was applause and so on.

もうその時点でね

At that point already.

もうこんな光景なかっただろうなって

I guess there hasn't been a scene like this for a long time.

ぐらい柳瀬商店街の高島屋のとこに

At the location of Takashimaya in the Gurinai Yanase shopping district.

人が爆発的に溢れてるわけですよ

People are overflowing explosively.

うーん列に並べるときにね

Hmm, when you're lining up...

もうこんな光景なかっただろうなってぐらい柳瀬商店街の高島屋のとこに人が爆発的に溢れてるわけですよ

It's been a long time since I've seen such a scene; the Takashimaya in Yanase shopping street is overflowing with people explosively.

もうこんな光景なかっただろうなってぐらい柳瀬商店街の高島屋のとこに

I don't think there was ever a scene like this at Takashimaya in Yanase Shopping Street.

人が爆発的に溢れてるわけですよ

People are overflowing explosively.

生命体の高島屋の写真は撮っていくとか

I heard that they are taking pictures of the living entity at Takashimaya.

うーん

Hmm.

で

And

前を通って初めて

For the first time passing by.

あ、京川なんていう人もいたりとか

Oh, there was also someone named Kyokawa.

したんだろうね

I guess you did it.

うーん

Hmm.

とにかく人が

Anyway, people.

歩いてたり

Walking.

足を止めてたり

Stopping in place.

歩いてた人も一瞬足を止めたり

Even the people who were walking stopped for a moment.

っていうような

It's like that.

そんな

Like that.

うーん

Hmm.

9時半から10時までの間

Between 9:30 and 10:00.

でいざ開店して

And then, the opening begins.

うーん

Hmm.

なんかその日のために作られた紙袋

A paper bag that seems to have been made for that day.

47年間ありがとうみたいな

"Thank you for 47 years."

ものの写真

Photo of things

高島屋のその

That of Takashimaya.

絵と

With the picture

外観の絵とね

It's a picture of the exterior.

そのメッセージとか書かれた紙袋の中に

Inside the paper bag with that message written on it

バラが2本刺さってるものを

Two roses are stuck in it.

あのバラが2本包まれたものを

The one wrapped with those two roses.

手渡してもらって

Please hand it over to me.

うーん

Hmm.

でまあ

So, well...

みんなこうやって店の中に

Everyone is like this inside the store.

なだれ込んでいくわけですよ

They will come rushing in.

うーん

Hmm.

まあ商品なんかほとんど残ってた

Well, there were still almost all the products left.

残ってなかったりするんだけど

It might not be left anymore.

うーん

Hmm.

なんだろうね

I wonder what it is.

あれは

That is

商品というか思い出を

More than a product, it's a memory.

カゴに入れに来てるんだな

You're coming to put it in the basket, huh?

っていう風に思いましたけどね

I thought it was like that.

みんなね

Everyone, you know.

うーん

Hmm.

で入り口の近くにメッセージボード

There's a message board near the entrance.

っていうのがあって

There is that.

しばらく前からやってたんだろうけど

You must have been doing it for a while now, right?

その手書きでね

"With that handwritten note."

その正方形の紙に

On that square piece of paper

まあA4の紙を

Well, an A4 sheet of paper.

そうだなあ

I see.

6分割ぐらいにしたような

It looks like it was divided into about six parts.

正方形の紙に

On a square piece of paper

うーん

Hmm.

メッセージを書いてるわけですよ

I'm writing a message.

でそれが貼り付けてあるボードに

"on the board where it is attached"

そうすると

Then...

まあおばあちゃんに連れてきてもらったけ

Well, my grandma brought me here.

あのー

Um...

それが

That is it.

いい思い出です

It's a good memory.

そのおばあちゃんは

That grandma

亡くなっちゃったけどもとか

"They passed away, but..."

うーん

Hmm.

とにかく

Anyway

なんだろうなあ

I wonder what it is.

親に連れてきてもらったけども

I was brought here by my parents, but...

それからしばらくしたら

After a while,

自分が自分の子を連れてきました

I brought my own child with me.

そういった思い出の店ですとかね

It's a store that holds such memories.

書いてあったりするわけ

It might be written down.

でこれ写真撮っていいですかなんて

"Is it okay if I take a picture?"

店員さんにあの聞いて

I asked the store clerk about that.

写真に全部収めてきたけどね

I captured everything in the photos.

うん

Yeah.

まあセール品に群がる人もいて

Well, there are people who flock to sale items.

残ってるセール品に群がる人もいて

There are people swarming around the remaining sale items.

上の階まで行ってみると

When I went up to the upper floor,

今まではね

Until now.

今まではっていうか

Up until now, or rather...

この前来た時は

The last time I came.

ある程度人がいるなっていう風に思った

I thought there were a certain number of people present.

本屋さんがまあ一番人が少ないっていうような

I suppose the bookstore is where the least number of people are.

逆転現象が起こってたりするわけだ

It seems that a reversal phenomenon is occurring.

でやっぱりその最後に地下に行ってみたんだけど

So, in the end, I decided to go down to the basement.

まあいわゆる

Well, what's called

あれですよ

That's it.

大行無列ですよ

It's a great procession.

何かってやっぱり

What is it, after all?

ご座候なんだね

You're a sweet bean paste-filled pastry, huh?

味まんですよ

It's about the flavor.

うんもう

Yeah, already.

階段にはみ出してるっていうところの話じゃなくて

It's not about the part where it's sticking out on the stairs.

2階3階まで行ってるんだよ

It's going up to the second and third floors.

その階段の列が

That line of stairs.

開店直後で2時間半だって

It's already been two and a half hours since the store opened.

街

Town

で店内回ってくるって待って

"I'm waiting for you to come around the store."

外に出て外にいた人に話聞いてみたら

I went outside and talked to the people who were out there.

もう3時間超えてるって言ってた

They said it's already been over 3 hours.

ちなみにね

By the way, you know...

電車で20分行って

Take a 20-minute train ride.

名古屋の高島屋ってがあるんだけど

There's a Takashimaya in Nagoya.

これ

This

名古屋の高島屋ってJR直通です

The Takashimaya in Nagoya is directly accessible by JR.

駅の中から直接入れんの

You can enter directly from inside the station.

だから言ってみれば

So, to put it another way,

電車に乗りさえすれば

As long as I get on the train.

20分で名古屋の高島屋に行けんの

I can get to Takashimaya in Nagoya in 20 minutes.

その中にご座候って入ってるんですよ

Inside that, there's a "sousaku" (sweet bean paste) filling.

だから3時間並んでる人は

So, the people who are waiting for 3 hours...

別にその列を離れてだよ

It's just that I will be leaving that line.

歩いてでもいい

It's okay to walk.

自転車でもいいんだけど

A bicycle would be fine, too.

岐阜駅に行って

Go to Gifu Station.

電車に乗れば

If you take the train

まあせいぜい1時間から1時間半ぐらいで

Well, at most it will take about 1 to 1.5 hours.

ご座候変えるんだけど

I'm going to change the filling.

やっぱりみんなここで買いたいわけですよ

After all, everyone wants to buy it here.

あそこで

Over there.

やっぱりデパートって

After all, department stores...

物を買いに来てるわけじゃ

I'm not here to buy anything.

みんなないんだなって思ったの

I thought that everyone is in the same situation.

本当に基本的な気づきなんだけど

It's a truly basic realization, but...

本当に基本的なこと

Really basic things.

でしかもその現象っていうのは

And moreover, that phenomenon is...

外から見れば

From the outside, it looks...

そんなさって

Well then...

閉店が分かってるから

Because I know the store is closing.

まあ明日明日そうだとか最終日だってなってから集まってるけど

Well, we’re gathering only after saying it’s tomorrow or the final day.

普段からこういう風に足を運んでれば

If you usually make an effort like this...

こんな風になってなかったでしょって

It wasn't supposed to turn out like this, right?

良い意見も分かるし

I understand good opinions as well.

俺はそういう風に思ってきたもんだって

That's how I've thought about it.

ギフの場合はちょっと事情が違ったりするんだけど

In the case of Gifu, the circumstances are somewhat different.

ちょっとこれ複雑なんだけど今回は省きます

This is a bit complicated, so I'll skip it this time.

あの連載読んでください

Please read that serial.

宣伝しますけど

I will promote it, though.

ギフの場合はそういった特殊な事情があるっていうことを踏まえても

Even considering that there are such special circumstances in the case of Gifu,

でも普段から確かにこのぐらいのお客さんが来てればね

But if we usually had this many customers,

そういった閉店にはならなかったと思う

I don't think it ended up closing like that.

だけど

But

そうだね1時間半前の行列に加わってみたり

That's right, trying to join the line from an hour and a half ago.

いろんな人に話を聞いてみたりお客さんとかね

I've tried talking to various people, including customers.

先着400名

First 400 people.

70人もらえるバラっていうのも結構やっぱり貴重だったみたいで

It seems that receiving 70 roses was quite precious after all.

俺がそのね紙袋を持ったまま一通り店を見て

I looked around the store while holding that paper bag.

外に出て写真を撮って

Go outside and take a picture.

でせっかくだからと思ってその紙袋からバラをね

Since it's such a great opportunity, I thought I'd take the roses out of that paper bag.

2本入ったバラを取り出して

Take out the two roses.

高島屋の外観とそのバラが重なるような写真を撮ってたの

I was taking a photo where the exterior of Takashimaya and the roses overlap.

そしたらね話しかけてくれるんだよ

Then, they'll talk to you.

すいませんそれってもらったんですかって言われるから

I'm sorry, but I'm asked if I received that.

あそうなんですちょっと並んでって

Oh, is that so? Please wait a moment in line.

何時から並びました?

What time did you line up?

って言われたから

Because I was told so.

いや8時半ぐらいから

No, around 8:30.

はぁー私9時半すぎに来たんだけど

Haa, I came after 9:30 though.

そっかその時間じゃやっぱり間に合わなかったんですね

I see, so it really wasn't possible to make it in time after all.

なんて言われたからさ

Because of what was said.

よかったらお貸ししましょうかつってそのバラ貸して

If you’d like, shall I lend you that rose?

写真その人もね一人で来てたけど

That person came alone too, you know.

じゃあお借りしますって

Well then, I'll borrow it.

俺と同じようにね

Just like me.

その高島屋とバラの花が重なるような写真撮ってたりするから

Because I'm taking pictures that overlap the Takashimaya and the rose flowers.

これ使えんなと思って

I thought this wouldn't be useful.

しばらくこの店の前にいようと思ってたのね

I was thinking of staying in front of this shop for a while.

バラを見せつけるように

To flaunt the roses.

そしたらやっぱりね

Then, after all, you know...

おばあちゃんとその娘さんらしき

It seems to be the grandmother and her daughter.

50歳60歳ぐらいの女性が

Women around 50 to 60 years old.

こう二人で連れ立ってきてたりするわけ

It's like the two of us have been together like this.

でスマホで写真撮るんだけど

I take pictures with my smartphone.

じゃあお母さん先に撮って

Then Mom, you take the picture first.

じゃあ私次撮ってもらうって

Well then, I'll have you take the next one for me.

一人一人なんか入れ替わりながらやってっから

Each person is switching in and out while doing it.

じゃあ撮りましょうかつって写真

"Well then, shall we take a picture?"

でよかったらしかもこのバラ持って撮ったらどうですかとかってやるとね

If you don't mind, how about taking a photo with this rose?

食いつきがいいんだよ

They're really into it.

だから写真撮ったついでに

So, while I was taking pictures...

ちょっとお二人でいろいろ昔から来てたんですからって話を聞くと

"When I hear you two talking about various things you've been through since long ago..."

やっぱり猫座候がどうことか

As I thought, what about the cat seat?

やっぱりなんかこうイベントごとにとか

After all, it seems like there are events like this...

最近は来てなかったけどとか

I haven't been coming recently, but...

閉店をしてから来たんだけどとかっていうことで

I came after the store closed, but...

話はきっかけが生まれる

Conversations give rise to opportunities.

でやっぱりみんなね

But after all, everyone...

本当に仕事帰りに毎日来てたって人も中にはいたんだけど

There were indeed some people who came here every day after work.

最近遠のいててって本当にでも残念でなんて人もいるわけ

Recently, there are people who feel really disappointed about drifting apart.

だから本当にこれをね

So really, this.

あの皮肉な目線で見ればだからだろっていうのに思うし

I think it’s because of that ironic gaze.

それは本当だと思うんだけど

I think that's true.

だけどなんかね

But somehow, you know...

それで終わらせちゃいけない何かがあるなっていうことをずっと感じたかな

I felt for a long time that there was something that shouldn't just end there.

それは何かって言うとやっぱりみんな

What that means is, after all, everyone...

あそこに家族がいるんですよ

There is a family over there.

家族の思い出を置きっぱなしにしてきたのを

I have left behind my family's memories.

取りに来たんだなと思ったの

I thought you came to pick it up.

うん

Yeah.

あの時お父さんお母さんとすごく仲良かったのか

Were you really close with your dad and mom back then?

仲良かったよなとかきっとねこれ想像だよ

We were really close, right? But I'm sure this is just my imagination.

あと死んじゃったおばあちゃんと一緒に来たよなっていう思い出を

It's a memory of coming here together with my grandmother who has passed away.

みんな回収しに来たんだよ籠の中にね

Everyone came to collect it, you know, inside the basket.

うん

Yeah.

なんで

Why?

じゃあ回収する必要があるかっていうと

So, is there a need to collect it?

きっと今家族との思い出って

Surely, memories with family right now…

作りづらくなってるんじゃないかなと思うわけですよ

I think it has become difficult to create.

昔と比べてね

Compared to the past.

その各家族化が進んだり

The trend of each family becoming more individualized has progressed.

結婚しても子供を作らないっていう夫婦も当然いる

There are certainly couples who choose not to have children even after getting married.

で結婚そのものをしないっていう人もいる

There are some people who say they won't get married at all.

これはなぜかって言ってやっぱり社会が成熟していくと

This is because, as society matures,

そういったものがあるんですよ

There are things like that.

そういったものは出てきて当然だと思うんですよ

I think it's only natural for such things to come up.

昔と日本っていうのはやっぱり結婚して子供を産んで

In the past, Japan was about getting married and having children.

それをどんどんどんどん子供を増やしていかないと

We need to keep increasing the number of children more and more.

おそらく国としても厳しかったし

It was probably tough for the country as well.

個人としても難しかった部分があると思うんだよね

I think there were parts that were difficult on a personal level as well.

世間の目とか労働力を増やさなきゃいけないとか

I have to consider public perception and increase the workforce.

そういった個人とか組織とか国とかそういったレベルで

At that level, such as individuals, organizations, or countries.

やっぱりみんなどんどん結婚をして子供を産もうっていう風に

After all, it seems that everyone is increasingly inclined to get married and have children.

家族でいいし

It's fine with just family.

家族の結束っていうのが必要だったりっていうのはあると思うんだけど

I think there is a need for family togetherness.

今これだけなんだろうな

I guess this is all there is right now.

その環境が整っていくと別に一人でも生きられるし

Once the environment is improved, one can live alone if necessary.

一人で生きる楽しさも便利さもあるし

There are joys and conveniences in living alone.

わざわざ家庭を作って子供を産んで増やしてっていうことは

The act of deliberately creating a family, giving birth, and increasing the number of children...

生きていくのに必要はなくなったわけ

It became unnecessary to live.

だけど

But

そもそもそういったものを知ってる人に

To begin with, to those who know such things.

とっては時代の移り変わりで

It is a reflection of the changing times.

そういったものが必要がなくなった社会っていうのは

A society where such things are no longer needed.

どっかで何かしら欠落したものを抱えてるんじゃないかなって

I feel like there's something missing somewhere.

ちょっと思ったのね

I just thought a bit.

でみんなそれはデパートの中に

But everyone, that's inside the department store.

置いたままにしてあったんじゃないかなっていう

I think it was just left as it was.

だから当然親子で来てる人もいるんだけど

So naturally, there are people who come together as parent and child.

この仲のいい親子でさえ

Even this close parent and child.

昔はもっといろんなとこに

In the past, there were more places.

一緒に出かけてたよねとか

We used to go out together, right?

なんか昔と今とに比べて

Compared to the past and now

欠けてしまったものを感じて

Feeling the things that have been lost.

それを拾いに来たんじゃないかなっていうのを

I think that's why they came to pick it up.

やっぱりその現場に行って話を聞いて

After all, I should go to the site and hear what they have to say.

するうちにみんな家族の話するなと思ったの

I thought that everyone would start talking about family.

だから気づいたのかなぁ

I wonder if that's why they realized it.

うん

Yeah.

だから家族っていうものが生きることに

That's why family is essential to life.

必ずしも必要じゃなくなったから

Because it has become unnecessary.

デパートっていうのは衰退していったっていう

Department stores are said to be in decline.

見方もできるんじゃないかなと思ったし

I thought it might be seen from a different perspective.

それがなくなるってなったから

Because it was going to disappear.

みんな思い出を取りに来たんじゃないかなっていう

I think everyone came to gather memories.

見方もできるんじゃないかなと

I think it could also be viewed that way.

だからお前たちが今まで行かなかったから

That's why you guys haven't gone until now.

デパートがなくなるんだよっていう皮肉は

The irony of saying that department stores are disappearing.

そういった側面から見ると全く的外れというか

From that perspective, it seems completely off the mark.

うーん

Hmm.

っていうことを

That is what I mean.

思ったのね

I thought so.

でなぜそういうことに気づいたかっていうと

The reason I realized such a thing is that...

寄付って電車に乗ってたり

"Donating while riding the train."

駅前の商店街って

The shopping street in front of the station.

その駅前のその繁華街歩くと

When you walk through that bustling area in front of the station

ヤンキーとかめちゃくちゃ多いんですよ

There are a lot of delinquents, you know.

うんなんかもう明らかにやんちゃだなーって人多いんだけど

Yeah, there are clearly a lot of people who are just mischievous.

デパートにねいないのそういう人って

People like that aren't in department stores, you know.

お客として

As a customer.

うん

Yeah.

いやそれはデパートで買い物

No, that is shopping at the department store.

それそのなんていうのお客さんの層とかってあるだろうって思うかもしんないけど

You might be thinking that there are different types of customers or something like that.

でも五座候って一個110円だよ

But a set of five costs 110 yen.

そしたらさヤンキーの人たちだって別に買いに来たりもするんじゃない

Well, I guess even the delinquents might come to buy it too.

そんな高級な服とかいらねーよとかっていう風に思ってる人でも

Even people who think, "I don't need such expensive clothes,"

その俺が着てるものってのはブランドがデパートに置いてるものと違うんだよって思う人でも

Even for those who think that what I'm wearing is different from what brands have in department stores,

110円のさ美味しいものがあったら買いに来ても安そうだなって思うんだけどいないんだよ

I think if there were something delicious for 110 yen, it would seem worth coming to buy, but there isn't anything.

だいたい髪の毛は黒い人か

Usually, people have black hair, right?

あとまあ

Well then...

高齢の方なんかちょっとブラウンとか紫が入った方とかいるけど

There are some elderly people with a bit of brown or purple in their hair.

みんな服装が大人しいか上品

Everyone's clothing is either modest or elegant.

高級袖

Luxury sleeves

金髪とかダボダボの服着たヤンキーとかね

Like a yankee with blonde hair and baggy clothes, you know?

全然いないんだよ

They're not here at all.

これ何かなと思ったの

I was wondering what this is.

おそらく

Probably

あのヤンキーって呼ばれる人たちって

Those people called yankees...

すでにね家族の思い出なんて今も充実してるんじゃないかなと思う

I think family memories are still fulfilling even now.

ある人たち言うじゃん

Some people say, right?

ファミリーとか家族って言う言葉簡単に

Words like "family" or "household" are used so easily.

あれってねリアルタイムでちゃんと家族があるんだよ

You know, that actually has a family in real time.

それは自分のその血のつながった家族とも

That is with one's own blood-related family as well.

それ反抗期とかいろいろあっただろうけど

There were probably various things like a rebellious phase, but...

絆は失われてないし今もきっと思い出を作ってるし

The bonds haven't been lost, and surely we're still creating memories now.

それ以外でも友人とか先輩後輩っていうつながりの中で

In addition to that, within the connections of friends and senior/junior relationships.

ファミリーを築いてるから

Because I am building a family.

あの人たちにとって置き忘れた家族の思い出って

For those people, the memories of their forgotten family...

デパートの中にないんじゃないかと思うわけ

I think it's probably not inside the department store.

だから取りに来る必要がないんだよ

So there's no need to come and pick it up.

彼らは名古屋とかそういった都市部とか

They are in urban areas like Nagoya.

イオンモールとかにすでに家族の居住地っていうのを

"Such as Aeon Mall, there is already a family residence."

思い出の生産上っていうのを移してる

"I'm transferring memories to production."

だからデパートには来る必要がない

So there's no need to come to the department store.

ああ

Ah.

なんかね

You know...

じゃ

Then.

これについて

About this.

その現状について

Regarding that situation.

分析した上で未来がどうなっていくんだろうっていうところまで

I wonder how the future will unfold based on the analysis.

まだ時間も俺の分析も及んでないんだけど

I still haven't had the time or the opportunity to analyze it.

観察の結果としては

As a result of the observations

そんなことを感じたかな

Did you feel something like that?

残念ながら山形の場合は

Unfortunately, in the case of Yamagata,

小沼デパートが本当に閉店しましたっていう発表をしたおかげでさ

Thanks to the announcement that Konuma Department Store has really closed down...

デパートっていうものが

What is called a department store

我々にとってどういう存在だったのかっていうのを

What kind of existence it was for us.

じっくり考えるきっかけっていうのは

The opportunity to think things over carefully is...

なかったし

There wasn't any.

あったとしてもかなり特殊な事例に追いやられてたから

Even if it existed, it was relegated to a rather特殊 case.

難しかったんだけど

It was difficult, but...

なんか今回ね

This time, somehow...

3日間で終わったけどじっくり観察をして

It ended in three days, but I observed carefully.

そう

That's right.

なんていうかな

What should I say?

言い方難しいね

It's hard to put into words.

あの差別するわけじゃないんだけど

I'm not trying to be discriminatory, but...

いわゆる文化的に成熟しちゃって

"What's known as cultural maturity has been reached."

家族を必要としなかったしなくなってった人と

The person who no longer needed their family.

いわゆる今も家族とかファミリーの中で生きてく

In other words, I still live within my family and among my loved ones.

生きてるヤンキーっていう人たちとの

With the living yankees.

その中にその間にあるデパートっていうものは

The department store that is in between.

なんかじっくり分析する価値はあるんじゃないかな

I think it might be worth analyzing in depth.

っていうふうに思う

I think that's how it is.

これからのデパートのためにもね

For the sake of the future of department stores.

で

So, then.

当然原稿を書くための取材なんで

Of course, it's research for writing the manuscript.

ちょっとお盆休みを挟みますが

I'll take a little break for the Obon holiday.

次の原稿8月の後半かな

The next manuscript will be in late August, I think.

締め切りね

It's a deadline, right?

そういった分析を踏まえて

Based on that analysis.

ここから時間が経てば

If time passes from here

もっといろいろ考えることもあるだろうし

There might be more things to consider.

なんていうかな

What should I say?

俺の頭の中も熟成してって

My mind is also maturing.

いろいろ考えることもあるだろうし

There are probably various things to think about.

今話してたよりももっと分かりやすく

Even more easily understandable than what we were just talking about.

できると思うんだけど

I think I can do it.

今はちょっとそんなふうに考えてたかな

I was thinking a bit like that just now.

あとはとにかく暑かったね

It was really hot, after all.

体調を崩しました

I have fallen ill.

食欲も全然ないし

I have no appetite at all.

でもそういった代償を払って

"But paying such a price..."

それでもまだ満足してるんですよ

I’m still satisfied, though.

できるような取材旅行だったかな

I wonder if it was a trip for interviews that we could actually do.

というふうには

In that way

思ってはいるんです

I am thinking about it.

うーん

Hmm.

っていうところかな

I guess that's about it.

うーん

Hmm.

まあいろいろとまた話したいことはあるんだけど

Well, there are various things I want to talk about again.

なんかね

You know…

そっちにそれると

If you stray over there...

また

Again

どうせ

Anyway

ボタンが

The button is.

次にしちゃうかな

I wonder if I'll do it next.

っていうのがあるんで

So there's that.

この辺にしておきます

I'll leave it at that for now.

岐阜

Gifu

楽しいですよ

It's fun!

なんか

Something.

なかなか行く理由って

It's quite hard to find a reason to go.

東北の人間からするとね

From the perspective of a person from Tohoku, you know.

岐阜旅行って計画しづらい

Planning a trip to Gifu is difficult.

計画したとしても

Even if you plan it.

日田高山とかね

Hita Takayama and so on.

元岐阜でも

Even in Gifu.

三貫部って言うとあれだよね

When you say "sankanbu," that's related to that, right?

元関西寄りの方だと思うんだけど

I think they are more from the Kansai region.

あの

Um...

岐阜市

Gifu City

もう名古屋のすぐ近くにある

It's already very close to Nagoya.

全国的に見ても

Even from a national perspective.

日本一となり合ってる

It's ranked number one in Japan.

県庁所在地らしいよ

It seems like it's the prefectural capital.

名古屋と岐阜ってのは

Nagoya and Gifu are

ああ

Ah.

だけどあの岐阜のシャッター街を見るとね

But when I see that shuttered street in Gifu, you know...

別に俺が何かできるわけじゃないんだけど

It's not like I can do anything, really.

本当に

Really.

いろんなことが

Many things.

考えるしね

I think so too.

高度性経済成長期って何だったんだろう

What was the period of high economic growth?

バブルって何なんだろうとか

I wonder what a bubble really is.

今の我々にとって

For us now

このサイズの商店街って

A shopping district of this size...

やっぱり必要ないんだろうなとか

I guess it's really unnecessary, huh?

じゃあこれを復活に持っていくべきなのか

So should I take this to the revival?

もっとコンパクトにして

Make it more compact.

新しい日本

New Japan

例えば人口1億人を切っても

For example, even if the population falls below 100 million.

住みやすくて

Easy to live in

楽しい日本に

To enjoyable Japan.

リサイズしていくのか

Are we going to resize it?

とかね

You know what I mean.

なんかいろいろ考えるよ

I think about various things.

名古屋に行ったら

When I go to Nagoya

名古屋に行ったで

I went to Nagoya.

すげえなと思うしね

I think it's amazing.

外国人はいっぱいだし

There are a lot of foreigners.

人はあふれてるし

There are a lot of people.

だから暑いしね

That's why it's hot.

だから

So.

岐阜に行くことによって

By going to Gifu

名古屋も楽しめるしね

You can also enjoy Nagoya.

名古屋より多分ホテルも安いし

Probably cheaper than a hotel in Nagoya as well.

何か岐阜に行きますっていうことがあれば

If there's anything that says I'm going to Gifu.

多分そうだな

Maybe that's true.

住んでたっていう人よりは

Rather than someone who just says they lived there.

俺はある程度詳しくなってると思うので

I think I have a fairly good understanding of it.

なんか聞いてください

Please ask me something.

どこのお店がいいですかとか

Which store is good?

何を食べりゃいいんでしょうかとか

What should I eat?

ホテルはどこを取り合いにしようかとかね

Where should we compete for the hotel?

とにかくデパートについては

Anyway, regarding the department store...

そうだな

That's right.

そう

Yes.

家族の思い出を欠落させてた人たちと

With the people who have lost memories of the family.

今も家族とファミリーを維持してる

I am still maintaining my family and family ties.

ヤンキーとの関係をちょっと考えちゃったかな

I might have thought a little about my relationship with the delinquent.

っていうのがまとめですね

That's the summary.

はい

Yes

ありがとうございました

Thank you.

本当に久しぶりの更新になりましたけども

It's been a really long time since the last update.

でも話せる環境と話せる材料が整ったら

But when the environment and materials for speaking are set up...

いつでもやろうと思いますんで

I'll think about doing it anytime.

はい

Yes

まあ聞き流しでいいんで

Well, you can just listen casually.

お付き合いください

Please go out with me.

おやすみなさい

Good night.